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Thread: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2[W:1, 183, 386, 590]

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    You forgot that by law all persons recieve the same treatment in emergency rooms whether they have insurance or not. That law will not be changed so accident victims will be left on the side of the road to die. So stop the foolishness.
    The foolishness is calling it "responsibility" when something is imposed on me against my will. There's no "responsibility" in that. I am just the subject of an external force imposing its will upon me. In this case, the government is assuming responsibility for my own health risk management and leaving me without any real decision to make. If I refuse to buy insurance, my consequence should be that I don't receive medical treatment unless I'm prepared to pay cash for it. It should be my responsibility to assess that choice and accept the benefits or consequences.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    You forgot that by law all persons recieve the same treatment in emergency rooms whether they have insurance or not. That law will not be changed so accident victims will be left on the side of the road to die. So stop the foolishness.
    The only difference being that we'll get taxed to pay for it now.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    What is your point?



    Taking responsibility for the conscious decision not to buy an insurance product means accepting the consequence that you won't get the benefit of insurance if something happens. There is no element of "taking responsibility" for the things one has zero element of choice over in the first place.

    So by all means, let's let people finally be responsible again. Don't treat the uninsured unless they pay cash.
    Those decisions have already been made on a societal level. They are beyond debate.
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Those decisions have already been made on a societal level. They are beyond debate.
    On a societal level? How the hell do you come to that?
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    and if they decide to drive while uninsured and incur expenses as a result, the public will not have to cover those costs

    in contrast, that person who elects not to acquire health coverage but who then requires medical attention they are unable to afford will receive that medical care. and the public will be required to pick up the tab

    that public's ultimate guaranty of payment for medical services rendered is what makes the difference between the two scenarios
    Driving is a privilege, living is, well, life. If caught driving without insurance mandated by the State, and not the Federal government BTW, in some jurisdictions you could lose your privilege to drive for a period of time. Surely, you are not saying that a person without HC should be killed are you?
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Those decisions have already been made on a societal level. They are beyond debate.
    Ok, if that's how you want to shut down a discussion, fine, but then let's stop playing pretend about "individual responsibility" when what you're really referring to is government taking the responsibility and imposing its will on the individual.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    from Albert DS


    Health care quality will decrease for people who can't maintain their existing coverage because their employers decide to dump coverage and let the employees join exchanges. Lots of people with Cadillac plans who aren't in labor unions will find their employers scaling back coverage.
    If you are correct, even partially, you have provided a great reason why people need to get strong labor unions in their workplace.

    Medical equipment manufaturers will be subjected to a new level of regulation that will have the impact of reducing incentives for bringing new products to the market.
    Could you please show us where this is the case beyond your allegation that it is so? This seems like speculation on your part. I could do the same in the opposite direction and suggest that thirty million new health care customers would encourage new product development. But that also would be just speculation.

    The medical profession will change with bureacrats interposing themselves between physician and patient.
    They do today and now. They are called insurance companies.

    Seniors will experience a decline in the dollars devoted to their health care. Hundreds of billions will be diverted from Medicare to Obamacare.
    Again, this is speculation on your part with no real evidence offered to support it.

    Existing Medicaid patients will experience a decline in care as tens of millions of people are added to the rolls of Medicaid.
    More speculation.
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Look on the bright side of Obamacare. At least now we will have more IRS agents. Isn't that a good thing? Isn't that what everyone wants?

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Those decisions have already been made on a societal level. They are beyond debate.
    Beyond debate?? Nothing in a free society is beyond debate. Funny how your hypocrisy on the matter doesn't let you put beyond debate decisions society has made like the definition of marriage. The truth is, you want debate to end on this issues where you agree with societies conclusions and want debate to continue unabated on those societal decisions you disagree with. Pathetic perspective on your part, but that is not surprising.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Justabubba, your comment "that public's ultimate guaranty of payment for medical services rendered is what makes the difference between the two scenarios", Without a choice now, and with 30 million additional people suddenly thrust into guaranteed health care coverage, how are we to assume that the "public" will somehow now magically be able to pay? So now these people just automatically have pockets of money to pay for the health care they are guaranteed to receive? It's foolish to assume that just because a new law has been handed down, that suddenly, people will begin to have a way to pay for health care.

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