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Thread: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2[W:1, 183, 386, 590]

  1. #171
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Yeah. But on balance it's about 50/50 Republican/Democrat.
    Which would mean that 50% of sitting Democrats describe themselves as conservative. I doubt you could substantiate that.

    That was true in the 2010 elections. Republicans swept. They beat out Democrats in lots of categories Democrats usually win. But it isn't true currently, and it wasn't true in 2008. Obama won people with college degrees by a substantial margin in 2008 and over the last couple years we've seen a major swing with uneducated white Democrats going Republican and educated white Republicans going over to the Democrats. All the anti-education, anti-science, simplistic slogan stuff comes with a cost. They're trying to take uneducated white voters from the Democrats, and they're succeeding, but the cost is losing educated white Republicans to the Democrats.
    And in the 2008 elections, Democrats swept, mostly on the votes of young non-graduates.

    I'm done with this sub thread, though. This discussion is about ACA, not demonizing parties.
    Last edited by mac; 06-30-12 at 12:04 PM.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Which would mean that 50% of sitting Democrats describe themselves as conservative. I doubt you could substantiate that.
    blue dog democrats ...

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    And in the 2008 elections, Democrats swept, mostly on the votes of young non-graduates.
    college students mainly though, they were well on their way to coming in alignment with the future demographic.

  3. #173
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    blue dog democrats ...
    Is that 50% of sitting Democrats? From what I understand, it was mostly blue dogs that lost seats in 2010.

    college students mainly though, they were well on their way to coming in alignment with the future demographic.
    Mainly...I doubt it. The huge minority turnout for Obama was not "mostly college students."
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Is that 50% of sitting Democrats? From what I understand, it was mostly blue dogs that lost seats in 2010.
    the blue dog coalition is alive and well. A few other factors come into play. While more of the country may identify as conservative, it doesn't mean they vote. voting patterns for the last century are about 50/50 in totality, this is also true for the last 10-15 years.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Mainly...I doubt it. The huge minority turnout for Obama was not "mostly college students."
    The huge minority turn out, while a factor, was not what put him over the edge, which was the youth vote.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I'm in this thread to discuss the Affordable Care Act, not China or education or how you're being oppressed by the big scary black man. If you don't have anything substantive to add to the conversation, I'm not interested.
    I don't blame you. If I were you I wouldn't want to talk about the inexorability of external reality either.

    Our conversation meandered because we started talking about what conservatives could do now in the face of the decision in Roberts v. America. I said that the only thing they could do would be to do what the American political culture dictates. That's sabotage. Both sides do it. Then we talked about how bleak things were for my side, and I mentioned hard cold reality. Sorry for the digression.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    I have a BS in Liberal Arts (BSL), and I'm doing ok.
    What was your degree in? Do you have an advanced degree? What do you do for a living?

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Which would mean that 50% of sitting Democrats describe themselves as conservative. I doubt you could substantiate that.
    No, no. I am saying that Republicans get more of the conservatives than Democrats do, but Democrats get almost all the liberals and most of the moderates, so it ends up with the nation split about 50/50.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    the blue dog coalition is alive and well. A few other factors come into play. While more of the country may identify as conservative, it doesn't mean they vote. voting patterns for the last century are about 50/50 in totality, this is also true for the last 10-15 years.
    "Blue Dog membership was nearly cut in half by the 2010 Election, in which 26 members were re-elected but 28 were either defeated or chose not to run for re-election.
    The membership is expected to decline further in the 113th Congress. Membership is already down to 25 with the resignation of Jane Harman, one of their more liberal members. Furthermore, four prominent remaining Blue Dogs, Dennis Cardoza of California, Dan Boren of Oklahoma, Mike Ross of Arkansas, and Heath Shuler of North Carolina have announced their retirement; one member, Joe Donnelly of Indiana, is running for Senate (partially due to Republican redistricting efforts); and more members, such as North Carolina's Mike McIntyre as well as Georgia's John Barrow, have been or will be targeted by Republicans in redistricting efforts.[23] Additionally, the group is likely to shrink further with the defeat of Jason Altmire and Tim Holden in the 2012 Pennsylvania primary by more liberal politicians.[24]
    Freshman Blue Dogs in the House are sometimes nicknamed "Blue Pups".[5]"

    Blue Dog Coalition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Yeah, wik. Quick reference


    The huge minority turn out, while a factor, was not what put him over the edge, which was the youth vote.
    the "youth vote" statistically includes the increase in minority turnout.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

  9. #179
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    No, no. I am saying that Republicans get more of the conservatives than Democrats do, but Democrats get almost all the liberals and most of the moderates, so it ends up with the nation split about 50/50.
    They don't get most of the moderates. The moderates, or registered independants equal in number the Democrats and Republicans. It's the way they swing that normally determines the outcome. If they mostly leaned left, we'd have had mostly Democrats. Yet, the house lost majority, and the Senate lost super majority.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    "Blue Dog membership was nearly cut in half by the 2010 Election, in which 26 members were re-elected but 28 were either defeated or chose not to run for re-election.
    The membership is expected to decline further in the 113th Congress. Membership is already down to 25 with the resignation of Jane Harman, one of their more liberal members. Furthermore, four prominent remaining Blue Dogs, Dennis Cardoza of California, Dan Boren of Oklahoma, Mike Ross of Arkansas, and Heath Shuler of North Carolina have announced their retirement; one member, Joe Donnelly of Indiana, is running for Senate (partially due to Republican redistricting efforts); and more members, such as North Carolina's Mike McIntyre as well as Georgia's John Barrow, have been or will be targeted by Republicans in redistricting efforts.[23] Additionally, the group is likely to shrink further with the defeat of Jason Altmire and Tim Holden in the 2012 Pennsylvania primary by more liberal politicians.[24]
    Freshman Blue Dogs in the House are sometimes nicknamed "Blue Pups".[5]"

    Blue Dog Coalition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Yeah, wik. Quick reference
    I agree, it is in decline, but still healthy in my opinion. This is also why I expanded my point to mention more groups as they all come into play.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    the "youth vote" statistically includes the increase in minority turnout.
    of course it does, minorities have children too.

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