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Thread: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2[W:1, 183, 386, 590]

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    Huh?



    CBO | CBO Releases Updated Estimates for the Insurance Coverage Provisions of the Affordable Care Act
    (note not 'Fox news')...


    But I'm sure your response will be 'different 10-year span' as you did in the previous post.
    Um, no, my response is that your own link says that the CBO estimates that costs will be LOWER than originally anticipated.

    The Estimated Net Cost of the Insurance Coverage Provisions Is Smaller Than Estimated in March 2011
    CBO and JCT now estimate that the insurance coverage provisions of the ACA will have a net cost of just under $1.1 trillion over the 2012-2021 period-about $50 billion less than the agencies' March 2011 estimate for that 10-year period. (For comparison with previous estimates, these numbers cover the 2012-2021 period; estimates including 2022 can be found below.)
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    My arguments are not partisan but rather those of a realist. As you know I have been incredibly skeptical on where the money is going to come from. The 'upper middle class and wealthy folks' do not make enough to pay for all the changes this administration desires, ACA included. Also, the adjusted CBO numbers released earlier this year were pretty significant revisions…up. Given the GDP growth and UE projections have been woefully inaccurate my skepticism becomes more founded as time passes. Hoping it will work out is merely dreaming…IMHO

    ps. Since the CBO will score PPACA again since the SCOTUS has ruled wanna wager which way the 'costs' move?
    Here's the problem I have with this argument: Even if it somehow, someway, panned out to be true, it's two years too late.

    Where was all the helpful analysis from Republicans while the bills were being constructed? Nearly all of what we heard from the Right was this loud racket about death panels, job-killers, deficits, "Obamacare," socialism, government takeover, attacks on liberty, the Founding Fathers, and I know I'm forgetting a host of lines. Well, that was a decision they chose to make. What a rational, sensible Republican Party would have done is served as a realistic counterbalance to the Democrats' idealism: "OK, that proposal will work. No, that one won't, and here's why. Hmm, this one's tricky, let's discuss this." You know, kind of like the Founding Fathers did when they compromised about components of our government, such as the composition of the Senate vs. that of the House. Yeah, compromise. That thing that the Tea Party hates? They might wanna read ALL of what the founders did, not just the parts they like.

    But compromise could only happen if the Republicans were a rational, sensible party. That hasn't been the case in decades.
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    But compromise could only happen if the Republicans were a rational, sensible party. That hasn't been the case in decades.
    And you think ad hominem attacks on Republicans is going to promote this compromise? Really?

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    And you think ad hominem attacks on Republicans is going to promote this compromise? Really?
    So I'm supposed to just sweep the truth under the carpet? Get real. NOTHING from outside the camp will encourage Republicans to compromise. That change can only come from within.
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
    "Innocent until proven guilty is for criminal convictions, not elections." --Mitt Romney

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post

    As there is no way to estimate how many people will lose their employer paid health care when companies choose to pay their penalty the numbers above regarding costs to families and the government may both be understated.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    As there is no way to estimate how many people will lose their employer paid health care when companies choose to pay their penalty the numbers above regarding costs to families and the government may both be understated.
    what causes you to believe there is no way to estimate
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy the Kid View Post
    I'd lay a bet right now, that this Obamacare "penalty" will become a TAX on the backs of the middle clase. It can't possibly be financed by the 40 million who will be using this program, nor the famous 1% gang.

    If you beleive that our current HC system can take care of an additional 40 million people without needing more resources, i.e., doctors, nurses, etc. then you're dreaming.
    What you're doing is saying I don't care what we have, I kow it'll be something else evidence be damned.

    And those forty million will largely be paying their own insurance. Think about this for a moment.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    So I'm supposed to just sweep the truth under the carpet? Get real. NOTHING from outside the camp will encourage Republicans to compromise. That change can only come from within.
    When Obama and the Democrats were ramming through Obamatax against the will of the American Public through reconciliation, can you show me where they compromised?

    Thanks

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    What you're doing is saying I don't care what we have, I kow it'll be something else evidence be damned.

    And those forty million will largely be paying their own insurance. Think about this for a moment.

    You know Boo, I care that there are children who need HC. I'm all for helping those that can't help themselves.

    But I'm sorry that I can't go along with the "the govt knows best". Look at the 2 biggest programs - Medicare and Social Security. The govt took programs that could have worked as designed, but because the govt decided to ADD extra people who shouldn't have been added. The govt has taken money from these "lock box programs" and put it in the General Spending.

    The govt won't run this HC program any better than the others, IMO. They have a tendency to overload programs, and IMO, to BUY VOTES.

    Just heard on my local news that there is a BIG rise in people filing for SS disability. It's already in the red, along with Medicare.

    You can't convince me, with the govt in charge, that this Obamacare thing, won't become a burden on the middle class. It and all the necessities need to accomodate the additional people will have to be funded by the taxpapers. It's a TAX.
    Last edited by Billy the Kid; 07-08-12 at 08:17 AM.

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