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Thread: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    Obama Care hidden costs. As we move toward a Canada health care system, we will experience the pit falls rarly considered.



    What a disaster for America following in these same footsteps..
    Yep, it's much more efficient to overpay by hundreds of billions every year.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Is it really that big a deal to wait a few extra weeks for non-emergency care?
    Tell that to the guy or gal with the pinched Sciatic Nerve.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Yep, it's much more efficient to overpay by hundreds of billions every year.

    "each patient loses about $3,490 each year as a result of having to wait 9.5 weeks between the time they see a specialist and the time they are able to receive care". Is it more efficient to get reduced premiums at the expense of reduced wages?
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    "each patient loses about $3,490 each year as a result of having to wait 9.5 weeks between the time they see a specialist and the time they are able to receive care". Is it more efficient to get reduced premiums at the expense of reduced wages?
    And you're assuming that the wait time here is zero?

    'fraid not.

    And to repeat -- HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS A YEAR is what we overspend relative to other OECD countries.
    Last edited by AdamT; 06-29-12 at 05:59 PM.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    "each patient loses about $3,490 each year as a result of having to wait 9.5 weeks between the time they see a specialist and the time they are able to receive care". Is it more efficient to get reduced premiums at the expense of reduced wages?
    Every Canadian is off work for 9.5 weeks every year due to having to wait for health care?

    No kidding?

    Then, Canadians should be chomping at the bit to get a US style of health care, correct?

    OK, Canadians, I know that there are some on this board. How many would trade health care systems with the USA?
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    ..OK, Canadians, I know that there are some on this board. How many would trade health care systems with the USA?
    I know of more than a few Canadians who REFUSE to even vacation to the USA for a weekend, such as driving down to NYC or Boston from Montreal or Toronto, simply due to our healthcare system.

    the danger of being injured & sick, and having to fork over tens of thousands of dollars, is just too much to bare.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Every Canadian is off work for 9.5 weeks every year due to having to wait for health care?

    No kidding?

    Then, Canadians should be chomping at the bit to get a US style of health care, correct?

    OK, Canadians, I know that there are some on this board. How many would trade health care systems with the USA?

    Speaking for myself, never in a million years.
    “No men are anywhere, and I’m allowed to go in, because I’m the owner of the pageant and therefore I’m inspecting it,” Trump said... “‘Is everyone OK’? You know, they’re standing there with no clothes. ‘Is everybody OK?’ And you see these incredible looking women, and so I sort of get away with things like that.”

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Problem is, our private health system is 100% more expensive than government run systems elsewhere. And our 100% socialist health system -- the VA -- is more efficient than our private system.
    Have you ever experienced a VA hospital? It's not 100% socialized by the way.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Every Canadian is off work for 9.5 weeks every year due to having to wait for health care?

    No kidding?

    Then, Canadians should be chomping at the bit to get a US style of health care, correct?

    OK, Canadians, I know that there are some on this board. How many would trade health care systems with the USA?
    My aunt in Edmonton had a form of cancer. The Canadian health care system diagnosed it after she became sick. She died while she was waiting in line for treatment. She should have come to America for surgery instead of waiting in Canada.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    Ah yes, of course! Is it a tax or not? Well, it's a choice, so how can a choice be a tax? Except that the choice is rather limited: you either get health insurance or get taxed. Hmm, but was the mandate designed to encourage people to get insurance or just penalize those who don't? Big Government or choice! Let the debate, I mean the hilarity, ensue!
    You have a choice to get a driver's license.

    You have a choice to purchase a car.

    You have a choice of where you wish to reside, specifically, once you reach adulthood.

    As such, as a licensed driver with a vehicle properly registed in the state where you reside, your state likely mandates that you have auto insurance (mimimum coverage: liability).

    Q: What happens if you get pulled over by your local police or state highway patrol and they discover you don't have auto insurance?

    A: You get a ticket that indicates a FINE you have to pay unless you can show proof of auto insurance.

    Well, the same thing now applies with those individuals who don't buy health insurance but can afford to purchase it. As myself and others have been saying all along, this health care issue (which is really a health insurance issue) is jurisdicational. The states control their roads and highways and, as such, have the right (state's rights, folks) to impose a fine on those drivers who don't have auto insurance. Since insurance is part of interstate commerce AND health care expenditures have dramatically increased over the years particularly for the taxpayer by virtue of:

    1) uncompensated care (hospitals)
    2) Mecicare expenses (i.e., prescription drugs, treatment, services, etc.) (federal government)
    3) Subsidized insurance premiums employer's pay on behalf of their employees (federal government)
    4) Medicaid costs (states)

    ...it stands to reason that the federal government would eventually step-up to do what neither the private sector nor the states were willing or able to do which is find a way to bring down the cost of health care nationwide (or atleast try) and increase access to health care.

    Back to the jurisdictional argument, here's an article from the Insurance Journal dated January 2006 on how Kansas state legislature determined to handly uninsured motorist in their state. Notice the clear similarities between the "fine" imposed for the uninsured at the state-level and the "penalty" that would now be imposed at the federal-level for the insured where health insurance is concerned. More specifically, note the argument Republicans within he Kansas state legislature uses and see if it's any different from the argument currently used in the health care debate.

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