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Thread: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

  1. #1521
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Where'd the buying insurance for $500 to $600 per year under ObamaCare come from?That's just false. It will be thousands of dollars a year and more than it is now.
    The example on the Treasury Dept's website was a family of 4 earning $50,000, who opted for the least expensive health insurance plan. With the federal subsidies, their expected family contribution is $2,070...or about $500 per person per year.

    http://www.treasury.gov/press-center...BFactSheet.PDF
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Umm $50,000 is actually ABOVE the median household income in this country. If you can't feed a family of four on $50,000, you're doing it wrong. And the individual premium is not $500 a month, it's $500 for an entire YEAR.



    Like I said, I'd gladly support more generous subsidies. But again, you don't actually believe what you're saying. Criticizing the ACA from the left is not going to get it repealed. What else you got?
    ObamaCare is not about fairness or cost, it is about taking gov't control of 1/6 of the U.S. GDP; medical care. Yes he did!
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    ObamaCare is not about fairness or cost, it is about taking gov't control of 1/6 of the U.S. GDP; medical care. Yes he did!

    Even if true what is the problem with that?

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    Re: Entire Healthcare Law Upheld

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    And what did the Dems say about it when it was a Republican idea?
    Some said it was a bad idea, others said it would be better than nothing. I'm not aware of ANY Democrats objecting to it on constitutional grounds.

    I've said it before, I like the idea of the mandate (if nothing else, it's nice to see people suddenly so on board with actually mandating personal responsibility) but I genuinely think it's blatantly unconstitutional. Can you not see even the possibility for legitimately believing that?
    I guess it depends what you mean by "legitimately believing that." I believe that you've whipped yourself into such a frenzy that you believe it *now*. But no, I don't believe that you or anyone else now objecting to it had any such objections before it was included in the ACA (even though the individual mandate was hardly an unknown policy idea at the time). Why? Because such objections simply did not exist anywhere across the political spectrum until the Republican Party decided to abandon the individual mandate en masse in 2009. Some of them flip-flopped so fast that they started denouncing it as unconstitutional before they had even removed their own names from OTHER bills containing an individual mandate.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 06-29-12 at 01:12 AM.
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Even if true what is the problem with that?
    If you really have to ask that question, l;ikely, no answer of mine will ever be able to explain it to you adequately. He just TOOK control of 1/6th of the ENTIRE GDP of the United States of America. Add to that the public secotr, and now you could say that the government DIRECTLY controls fully HALF of GDP.


    What happens when there are more public employees than private?
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    Well since you understand how supply and demand works, you should realize that Obama's healthcare plan would increase the supply to the medical industry. According to the law of supply and demand, this should reduce healthcare costs.
    By the government forcing socialistic rules on for-profit, private companies - then the fundamentals of the supply-and-demand rule goes out the window...and overall costs for the consumer go through the roof.



    Imo, in 5-10 years...the average amount Americans spend per capita on healthcare will be much higher then it is today.
    And the satisfaction of Americans in the quality of their healthcare will either stay the same or decline from where it is today.

    And America is already spending MILES more per capita then any other country in the world.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...PP)_per_capita

    Obamacare will only make that number climb (imo).
    Last edited by DA60; 06-29-12 at 01:32 AM.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

    So, CP, still think I'm overly critical?
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    If you really have to ask that question, l;ikely, no answer of mine will ever be able to explain it to you adequately. He just TOOK control of 1/6th of the ENTIRE GDP of the United States of America. Add to that the public secotr, and now you could say that the government DIRECTLY controls fully HALF of GDP.


    What happens when there are more public employees than private?
    How did he take control? Private insurance of your choosing to pay for private doctors and private hospitals prescribing medications from private pharmaceutical companies.... There's not much government in this government takeover.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

  9. #1529
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    Re: Entire Healthcare Law Upheld

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Some said it was a bad idea, others said it would be better than nothing. I'm not aware of ANY Democrats objecting to it on constitutional grounds.
    See, and I think it's actually a bad thing that the constitutionality of it was not ever even a concern.

    I guess it depends what you mean by "legitimately believing that." I believe that you've whipped yourself into such a frenzy that you believe it *now*. But no, I don't believe that you or anyone else now objecting to it had any such objections before it was included in the ACA (even though the individual mandate was hardly an unknown policy idea at the time). Why? Because such objections simply did not exist anywhere across the political spectrum until the Republican Party decided to abandon the individual mandate en masse in 2009. Some of them flip-flopped so fast that they started denouncing it as unconstitutional before they had even removed their own names from OTHER bills containing an individual mandate.
    I'll be honest, I didn't know what the individual mandate was before Obamacare. Speaking of flip-flopping, wasn't Obama against the mandate before he was for it? I, myself, changed my mind on the mandate. My view on it actually softened, but I don't care what a good idea something is, I cannot support it if I believe it's unconstitutional, and before you tell me there's no reasonable grounds to believe that it is, 4 of the Supreme Court justices thought so too.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758]

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    If you really have to ask that question, l;ikely, no answer of mine will ever be able to explain it to you adequately. He just TOOK control of 1/6th of the ENTIRE GDP of the United States of America. Add to that the public secotr, and now you could say that the government DIRECTLY controls fully HALF of GDP.


    What happens when there are more public employees than private?

    Uhmm until Wall Mart came along the public sector was the largest employer.

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