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Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/226]

Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

mac said:
In every case that Executive Privelege has been invoked due to national securtiy, it has been accepted by the court as valid. In the cases that it has been invoked and not related to national security (as was the case with both Nixon and Clinton) it has been overturned. :shrug:
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1. Once again you have failed to cite your 'facts'.

2. Even if your claim was true, barring some court opinion supporting your claim what you present could be mere coincidence. Correlation, causation, all that. Therefore you fail on the factual level as well as the logical level.

I think you will find that every time the courts have overruled executive privilege, an actual criminal investigation has been going on (with actual charges filed, a special prosecutor, etc). At this stage, Issa is not running a criminal investigation (nor may he even have the authority to do so).
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

American said:
OPSEC applies to all, so your underlying argument is wrong. If there are leaks, it's not the access but the security process that has failed. Information is disseminated on a need-to-know basis regardless of its classification. Just because you are cleared, does not mean you automatically have access.

Now I don't know about any secrecy oath, but every employee of the US govt (including all elected officials) are require to take an oath to protect and defend the Constitution, which by implication and explicitly by obtaining a security clearance level require you to secure the information you are given access to.
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So, basically you are agreeing with me then. These politicians aren't on a need-to-know basis. They just want the info for their political posturing purposes, which isn't a good enough reason to jeopardize the operations and people's lives.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

AdamT said:
How about Cheney's successful assertion of the privelege to hide transcripts of his closed door energy policy meetings, for one?
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Because it had something to do with national security, so they said. Apparently the court agreed.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

AdamT said:
They don't have a right to anything they request.
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Then why is there a Congressional Oversight Committee?
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

teamosil said:
So, basically you are agreeing with me then. These politicians aren't on a need-to-know basis. They just want the info for their political posturing purposes, which isn't a good enough reason to jeopardize the operations and people's lives.
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Right...right up to the point that they do have a need to know and then they are given access.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

AdamT said:
How about Cheney's successful assertion of the privelege to hide transcripts of his closed door energy policy meetings, for one?
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Who died ?
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

teamosil said:
So, basically you are agreeing with me then. These politicians aren't on a need-to-know basis. They just want the info for their political posturing purposes, which isn't a good enough reason to jeopardize the operations and people's lives.
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Don't kid yourself.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

mac said:
Then why is there a Congressional Oversight Committee?
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Wasn't there a 911 Commission? What was it they were investigating? Hmmmm, it'll come to me. Yes I think even the President himself testified or rather was interviewed. I think maybe Obama should be interviewed.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

Does anyone care about Randall Terry, Jaime Zapata or the many Mexicans killed by the weapons transferred to Mexico under the auspices of Fast and Furious? Is protecting Eric Holder the most important thing in the world to you? I am overwhelmed by revulsion.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

George W. Bush administration

The Bush administration invoked executive privilege on six occasions.

President George W. Bush first asserted executive privilege to deny disclosure of sought details regarding former Attorney General Janet Reno,[2]

the scandal involving Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) misuse of organized-crime informants James J. Bulger and Stephen Flemmi in Boston, and Justice Department deliberations about President Bill Clinton's fundraising tactics, in December 2001.[8]


Executive privilege - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Bush invoked exective privledge 6 times and he did the same thing for Janet Reno as Obama has done for Holder...so all the outrage is a few years to late.

So you cant say im being partisan Clinton invoked executive privledge 14 times....so Obama hasnt done a thing all presidents before him have done.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

Yeah, Obama is a lot like that moron Bush.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

Albert Di Salvo said:
Does anyone care about Randall Terry, Jaime Zapata or the many Mexicans killed by the weapons transferred to Mexico under the auspices of Fast and Furious? Is protecting Eric Holder the most important thing in the world to you? I am overwhelmed by revulsion.
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Actually, your post is overwhelmed with inaccurate information, since there is no conclusive evidence that "weapons transferred to Mexico under the auspices of Fast and Furious" killed Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry.

Randall Terry is an American pro-life activist and candidate for the Democratic Party's nomination for President in 2012. He also founded pro-life organization Operation Rescue.

I am underwhelmed by the repeated right wing attempts to use Agent Terry's death for their political gain, and in this instance while not even getting his name correct.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

AdamT said:
Great theory: how can the authorities know if you're doing anything wrong if we don't allow them to toss your home and office?
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Thats an emotional appeal and you know it.

Congress has a congressional duty to oversee the spending of American dollars and manpower and hold the executive accountable for its actions. They do not need probable cause, they dont need a search warrant. Now stop posting idiotic ****.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

Karl said:
Actually, your post is overwhelmed with inaccurate information, since there is no conclusive evidence that "weapons transferred to Mexico under the auspices of Fast and Furious" killed Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry.

Randall Terry is an American pro-life activist and candidate for the Democratic Party's nomination for President in 2012. He also founded pro-life organization Operation Rescue.

I am underwhelmed by the repeated right wing attempts to use Agent Terry's death for their political gain, and in this instance while not even getting his name correct.
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I am underwhelmed by your crocodile tears and attempts to act like you really give a crap about a border patrol agent when everyone on this board knows you do not. Im pretty sure its much more sad that you are using his death as a way to try to shame those that are behind the idea of getting to the truth of the operation that contributed to his death.

In short, you are way past despicable with this particular debate tactic.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

OpportunityCost said:
Thats an emotional appeal and you know it.

Congress has a congressional duty to oversee the spending of American dollars and manpower and hold the executive accountable for its actions. They do not need probable cause, they dont need a search warrant. Now stop posting idiotic ****.
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read this. it may fill in the gaps of your civics education: CRS/LII Annotated Constitution Article I
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

Issa accuses Obama of involvement in Fast and Furious operation - TheHill.com

Many of the documents that Issa has narrowly focused his request on center on the period of time after Feb. 4, 2011, when the Justice Department sent Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) a false letter claiming it did everything in its power not to let guns “walk” across the U.S.-Mexico border.

Ten months later the DOJ took the rare step of withdrawing that letter. Issa wants to know what agency officials learned in those months and how that decision was reached by reading their internal emails.

“I am hopeful that, consistent with assertions of executive privilege by previous administrations, you will define the universe of documents over which you asserted executive privilege and provide the committee with the legal justification from the Justice Department’s Office of Legal Counsel (OLC),” wrote Issa.

“To what extent were you or your most senior advisers involved in Operation Fast and Furious and the fallout from it, including the false Feb. 4, 2011, letter provided by the attorney general to the committee?"
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Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

lpast said:
George W. Bush administration

The Bush administration invoked executive privilege on six occasions.

President George W. Bush first asserted executive privilege to deny disclosure of sought details regarding former Attorney General Janet Reno,[2]

the scandal involving Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) misuse of organized-crime informants James J. Bulger and Stephen Flemmi in Boston, and Justice Department deliberations about President Bill Clinton's fundraising tactics, in December 2001.[8]


Executive privilege - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Bush invoked exective privledge 6 times and he did the same thing for Janet Reno as Obama has done for Holder...so all the outrage is a few years to late.

So you cant say im being partisan Clinton invoked executive privledge 14 times....so Obama hasnt done a thing all presidents before him have done.
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And Clinton was the first (and only) President since Nixon to have an invoked EP overturned. Since we are concerned about partisanship, that makes one Democrat and one Republican President to have an EP attempt overturned. Neither of them were Bush.

Let's focus on the now, m'kay?
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

j-mac said:
So, the President can invoke EP in furtherance of a cover up of a crime?

j-mac
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read it again. it is clear you did not understand what it said the first time
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

justabubba said:
read it again. it is clear you did not understand what it said the first time
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Well, it was a question...See the little curly thingy at the end of the sentence? Why not just answer the question instead of getting defensive?

j-mac
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

j-mac said:
So, the President can invoke EP in furtherance of a cover up of a crime?
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So, the Presidential invocation of EP is proof of a crime?
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

Where there is smoke. There's a fire. Unless someone is leading you into an ambush maybe.

Executive priv. when it comes to this matter = craploads of smoke. And I dont think this a a resource depleting tactic on Obama's political opponents.
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

Karl said:
So, the Presidential invocation of EP is proof of a crime?
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No, it is the attempt to shield the truth from being found....Please...Don't get silly.


j-mac
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

AdamT said:
The argument, of course, is that producing the genormous number of documents that Issa has requested would jeopardize many ongoing Justice Department investigations, and violote executive privilege.

Did you attack attack Bush and his AG when they asserted executive privilege in connection with the DA scandal?
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When Bush and his AG asserted executive privilege in the DA scandal, I recall liberals screaming about it. I’m sure you were one of them as well. How many people died as a result of that Bush so called scandal ?? But I am glad to see you are finally admitting that Bush did nothing wrong by asserting executive privilege in that case
 
Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

The Barbarian said:
When Bush and his AG asserted executive privilege in the DA scandal, I recall liberals screaming about it. I’m sure you were one of them as well. How many people died as a result of that Bush so called scandal ?? But I am glad to see you are finally admitting that Bush did nothing wrong by asserting executive privilege in that case
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The difference is that Holder has been cooperating. He has testified before Congress close to a dozen times and turned over 8000 pages of documents. In contrast, the witnesses in the DA case flat-out refused to testify AT ALL.
 
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