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Thread: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/226]

  1. #391
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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Clever again. Supply a letter NOT FROM OBAMA. The DOJ can not define or claim EP, only the POTUS, perhaps they will update Obama's teleprompter script soon or supply him an updated EP request form letter, but that is NOT the word, so far, issued from Obama and the WH. I supplied the WH spokesman link, you counter with a DOJ lawyer's OPINION in a reply to congress.
    How silly. The DOJ works for Obama. In this case they were speaking for the administration. This was the letter sent to Issa to formally announce the invocation of privilege. You should read it so you can have some clue what this whole hooha is really about.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

  2. #392
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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    Any proof for this theory?
    No proof one way or the other. Strong suspicions, but as of now, no proof. That is why the investigation.
    Holder is being held in contempt not because of executive privilege, but because at this point, there is no executive privilege. There is only the claim. Only the president can claim executive privilege, and he hasn't.

  3. #393
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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
    No proof one way or the other. Strong suspicions, but as of now, no proof. That is why the investigation.
    Holder is being held in contempt not because of executive privilege, but because at this point, there is no executive privilege. There is only the claim. Only the president can claim executive privilege, and he hasn't.
    Yes, he has.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    How silly. The DOJ works for Obama. In this case they were speaking for the administration. This was the letter sent to Issa to formally announce the invocation of privilege. You should read it so you can have some clue what this whole hooha is really about.
    Well, the letter wasn't included in that PDF. But from how they describe the letter in the PDF, it isn't what you say it is. It is a letter from the Atty General to the POTUS outlining why he thinkls the POTUS should claim EP. You have shown no letter from the POTUS to the congress asserting EP, or the legal reasoning behind it (required to claim EP).

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Yes, he has.
    Please read the post above (393)

    Holder has no more right to claim EP than I do.
    Last edited by jimbo; 06-21-12 at 07:24 PM.

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Yes, he has.
    It boggles the mind, doesn't it?

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by Karl View Post
    It boggles the mind, doesn't it?
    Total denial of reality. Amazing.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    Why do you think the documents are sensitive?
    The documents detailing a sting on the cartel? Of course they're sensitive. Even the ones that don't seem obviously sensitive on first glance, you'd need to do an incredibly careful review of each one before you could de-classify it. For example, some agent submitted an expense report with 25 receipts. Maybe one of them is for a cup of coffee from a particular coffee shop in Mexico somewhere. Maybe it turns out that they were there to meet the girlfriend of some mid level cartel guy who is tipping them off and the cartel knows she was in that coffee shop at the same time on the same day and kills her. Or maybe some boring seeming document about vehicle requisitions, they go through and scrub the names of the agents from all the fields, but somebody scrawled a note in there somewhere about so and so was driving it and bam that person's 3 year old is kidnapped from their home a week later. And to even figure out which of those documents you can release, you'd need to do extensive digging. You'd need to talk to agents that are out in the field, clear each individual document by a ton of people...

    And for what? Inevitably, most of the documents still couldn't be released to Issa and basically the public. So Issa would still be just as mad and the conspiracy theories would still be spinning just as fast. The DOJ already released tons and tons of documents, but Issa just keeps screaming regardless. This has nothing to do with reality. It's just Issa fanning the flames of teabagger conspiracy nuts, which does not require any reality to do. Even if they dedicated tons of resources to clearing and redacting as many documents as humanly possible without endangering lives, the headline on Fox the next morning would still be "Holder refuses to release rest of documents, heavily redacts, Issa threatening treason charges"...
    Last edited by teamosil; 06-21-12 at 08:18 PM.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

    Quote Originally Posted by Born Free View Post
    The war against the cartel. What war? Who has declared war? Has this war been sanctioned by congress? The cartel is a bunch of thugs. And what do we do, we send then guns, we arm the cartel that's how much we are at war with the cartel. We are at war, yeah right, and while we're at war we send them guns. Now tell me again who we're at war with.

    The facts are that our stupid government directed under Obama, gave guns to the cartel, and never followed one gun to see in who's hands they ended up in. Except they found one at the scene of one of our agents murdered. And you could care less who authorized this stupidity, you could care less if that person is fired, you could care less if Holder has lied to congress etc etc. In fact you want their stupidly to go unchallenged, as though nothing happened and no one got killed. That's right you have such blind faith in our government that you want to completely ignore stupidity, incompetence, and coverups for that stupidity and incompetence. Just let the dumb bastards do what they want.

    Last, you talk about releasing sensitive documents, yet this administration releases (leaks) on every sensitive thing they do. Have you not heard
    Doesn't seem like you were able to come up with a counter argument really...
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

    Let's all not overlook the obvious here... if Holder released all 80,000 documents that Issa wants, then Issa would merely turn around and subpoena another 80,000. The game being played here is clear... even to those playing it.

    It's the same of many 'debates' here at DP... a claim is made, a source is demanded, a source is provided, the source is dismissed on superficial grounds and another source is demanded. Ad nauseum.
    Last edited by Karl; 06-21-12 at 08:22 PM.

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