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Thread: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/226]

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by jerry7 View Post
    How has the AG's office managed to generate 140,000 documents on Fast and Furious? That is mind boggling.
    I was unaware they even generated that many documents on it.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Once again, the way you're coming from it is that one side is absolutely telling the truth and one side is completely lying. It is not fact that Holder said they'd have to close the investigation. He claimed that he offered them the documents under the condition that those documents satisfy the current subpena that was made for documents. They have been investigating this for quite some time now and if it is true that Holder turned over 7600 pages and is willing to submit another 1300 pages under the conditions that Issa will drop the current subpena, (not the investigation) and that would allow Holder to drop this issue and actually focus on other issues confronting the country, i would completely understand it.

    Also, I'm not sure exactly how much documentation you want on this (and I haven't read anywhere that the 1300 pages isn't everything Rev. You'e just assuming that). Assuming that he has turned over that much and is willing to submit another 1300, that equals 8900 pages. I heard conservatives whine for a year that the health care bill was 2000+ pages. Funny how 2000 pages is just insane when it's a democrat bill, but when it's information that conservatives want, 8900 just isn't even close.
    Let me guess, you think Holder will turn over those documents that prove he was lying, that show that fast & fuzzy was a sham, and was simply designed to boost the number of traceable U.S. arms in the hands of the Mexican drug cartel thugs? I am sure that Holder will have had them sorted, rather carefully, after being given months of free time to do so, making sure that those documents released show just what he wants them to show, that fast & fuzzy meant well, but it just got short funded/staffed, causing the trail to "dry up", all of a sudden, and really, really unexpectedly, so they tried another 1,000 guns or so, before realizing that following guns into a foreign country was just way too hard to do, and they just gave up. LOL ;-)
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 06-20-12 at 06:43 PM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  3. #243
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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Thanks for your opinion. I'm going to stick the my unbiased view though. It's not wise to assume something without the facts.
    Well, here is a part of your "unbiased view" from a view posts back ....

    ........... Assuming that he has turned over that much and is willing to submit another 1300, that equals 8900 pages. I heard conservatives whine for a year that the health care bill was 2000+ pages. Funny how 2000 pages is just insane when it's a democrat bill, but when it's information that conservatives want, 8900 just isn't even close.
    If I sold you a book that was 1000 pages as written, but only gave you 100 to read, that would not be a problem, correct ?

    If I had 80,000 pages of documents about a gun-running operation, and you were investigating me, its OK that I pick which 8000 pages for you to see, and withhold the rest ?

    Maybe you want to find a different self-appointed label besides "unbiased" <cough> ....

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    I was unaware they even generated that many documents on it.
    It's almost unbelievable.

    Holder Has 140,000 Fast And Furious Docs, Only Handed Congressional Investigator 7,600 - YouTube

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    I was unaware they even generated that many documents on it.
    You were just chastising me for "not having the facts". I got 'em. You apparently don't, now by your own admission.

    But you are learning while you try to keep up with the rest of us.

    A few of us are quite on top of the information.

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over F&F doc [W:116/2

    Quote Originally Posted by Eighty Deuce View Post
    If we ever get the truth .... and it is not as Holder has said, or they would not go to this length to stop a "witch hunt", it will be that this was all part of a gun control scheme. Holder and Hillary were starting to beat the gun-control drums back in 2009 over assault rifles ending up in Mexico. Hillary said it right in Mexico City, standing with their President. That was not just some coincidence. That was the intent of FF. Holder is also on record multiple times about gun control.

    All the pieces are there, and it fully explains the stalling, and now Obama's unprecedented actions. Never been EP invoked for such as this. It also flies against the standrds set by SCOTUS, as earlier documented.

    Many have noted this already. But it bears repeating. An illegal yet deliberate sham operation to provoke gun control. That's the prize here. That is what must remain hidden.
    Yep. You know it, I know it and Holder/Obama know it. But, just like with Solyndra, if you can't find a "smoking gun" (pun), like a memo from Obama to DOE saying pick Solyndra NOW, then it can't be "proven" that campaign cash begot a gov't guaranteed loan to Solyndra. Fast & fuzzy is the same type of critter, many, many mid-level gov't people that somehow have no idea just what went wrong, yet no memo directly from Holder/Obama that says let the guns walk and keep quiet about it. Yes he did!
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  7. #247
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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by Eighty Deuce View Post
    You were just chastising me for "not having the facts". I got 'em. You apparently don't, now by your own admission.

    But you are learning while you try to keep up with the rest of us.

    A few of us are quite on top of the information.
    You do not have the facts to back up your claim that Holder is lying. That's the difference. I made no claim that I knew exactly how many documents there were. Now I know how many. You claim that you know Holder is lying, and you do not have any evidence to support this other than your own biased opinion.

    That's the difference. There's nothing wrong with not knowing something. There is something with not knowing something but still proclaiming to know it regardless.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

  8. #248
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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Let me guess, you think Holder will turn over those documents that prove he was lying, that show that fast & fuzzy was a sham, and was simply designed to boost the number of traceable U.S. arms in the hands of the Mexican drug cartel thugs?
    Personally, I don't think that Fast & Furious was created with that intention in mind. You're tip-toeing the line of conspiracy theory with talk like that. Especially when there is no evidence to support that claim.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

  9. #249
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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Of course you have some proof that if those guns didn't walk, that agent would still be alive? I'de love to see it. [...]
    /facepalm ....
    And that pretty well sums up the right wing conspiracy theory right there, folks -- their entire argument is based upon the false premise that the gunwalking operation was responsible for Agent Terry's death. For that premise to be accurate they would have to provide a rational argument that, like iguanaman asked above, had Fast and Furious never been born then the armed gang that Agent Terry ran across that fateful night would have been unarmed (and therefore unable to shoot Agent Terry).

    Does anyone think that likely?

    Their argument also relies on the inference that a Fast and Furious gun is the one that fired the fatal bullet, which of course cannot be proven (the recovereed bullet was too badly damaged). However, even if it were a F and F gun that killed him, their argument would still be as above -- that without Fast and Furious Agent Terry would not have been shot. An irrational argument, of course, submitted only to harm the Obama administration politically, demeaning Agent Terry's death while they are at it. Shameful.

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    Re: Justice Dept says president has exerted executive privilege over Fast and Furious

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Personally, I don't think that Fast & Furious was created with that intention in mind. You're tip-toeing the line of conspiracy theory with talk like that. Especially when there is no evidence to support that claim.
    That's the problem in a nutshell, and why it is called an investigation. The job of the investigation committee is to determine the facts. When the what is determined, we then move on to the why and who. Then, if the facts warrant further actions, the actions should be taken. If not, no harm, no fowl.

    Holder is not providing the evidence believed to exist. That is contempt.

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