View Poll Results: Do you agree with NYs stop and frisk policy?

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  • I agree with the policy.

    2 20.00%
  • I agree in principal but the policy needs refinement.

    1 10.00%
  • I disagree with this policy.

    7 70.00%
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Thread: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

  1. #11
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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The language it it seems quite clear. Rewriting it would not stop politicians from blatantly violating it.
    That would depend on how it was written.

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Stopping and frisking people without a warrant regardless if it is random or a select group targeted blatantly violates the 4th amendment
    It may be. It shouldn't be, but it likely is. Probably part of why our streets aren't safe these days.

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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    That would depend on how it was written. .
    The constitution is written quite clear but elected officials enact blatantly anti-2nd amendment laws and in this case blatantly anti-4th amendment laws.


    It may be. It shouldn't be, but it likely is
    Its not a may be,It is a blatant violation of the 4th amendment.

    You have the right to be secure in your persons.No warrant no search.

    Probably part of why our streets aren't safe these days.
    Freedom is not supposed to be safe.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The constitution is written quite clear but elected officials enact blatantly anti-2nd amendment laws and in this case blatantly anti-4th amendment laws.
    If it's written in a way that they CAN disregard the meaning of the text, then it's written wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Its not a may be,It is a blatant violation of the 4th amendment. You have the right to be secure in your persons.No warrant no search.
    That's part of what I have a problem with.... the "Right" to blatantly protect criminals and ne'er to wells.

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Freedom is not supposed to be safe.
    Then I have no use for it, as you already know.

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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    ...Freedom is not supposed to be safe.
    most in society understand that you can have complete freedom......or complete safety.

    but you can never have both.

  5. #15
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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    If it's written in a way that they CAN disregard the meaning of the text, then it's written wrong.
    The 4th amendment is clearly written. You need a warrant to detain and or search someone and their property.The right to be secure in your persons means the government IE law enforcement can not frisk you, unless they have a warrant.


    That's part of what I have a problem with.... the "Right" to blatantly protect criminals and ne'er to wells.
    The bill of rights is a restriction on the government.These things are aimed at protecting citizens from the government.That means that some criminals will get away with stuff,that means anti-American trash can freely speak their mind, that means people can use collect money and buy political ads.


    Then I have no use for it, as you already know.
    As someone who is very conservative you should be very patriotic and that means supporting the constitution.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    My issue is that the language and grammar it is written in is no longer understandable by the vast majority of American citizens.
    Only by those who do not agree with what is written—who assume it must be some serious flaw in the way that it is written that does not allow for some government usurpation of rights that they want to take place.

    madison.jpg
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The 4th amendment is clearly written. You need a warrant to detain and or search someone and their property.The right to be secure in your persons means the government IE law enforcement can not frisk you, unless they have a warrant.
    Okay, then I simply disagree with it entirely.

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The bill of rights is a restriction on the government.These things are aimed at protecting citizens from the government.That means that some criminals will get away with stuff,that means anti-American trash can freely speak their mind, that means people can use collect money and buy political ads.
    Those are all significant flaws in my mind. A document that protects criminals, traitors, and imbeciles (aka politicians) cannot be worth very much in my mind.
    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    As someone who is very conservative you should be very patriotic and that means supporting the constitution.
    Ultra-Conservative/Authoritarian wasn't an option for "Lean" james.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    Only by those who do not agree with what is written—who assume it must be some serious flaw in the way that it is written that does not allow for some government usurpation of rights that they want to take place.
    You need to remember that some of us don't believe that the vast majority of american citizens deserve most of those Rights to begin with, Bob.

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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    You need to remember that some of us don't believe that the vast majority of american citizens deserve most of those Rights to begin with, Bob.
    Then you live in the wrong country.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    Then you live in the wrong country.
    I know, and I've been looking for an alternative that I can live with. Hopefully one will come up soon so I can get out of this cesspool.

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    Re: Thousands march against NYC’s controversial ‘stop-and-frisk’ policy

    I do not have issue with this policy being in place. It is not a violation of the 4th amendment at all. The 4th amendment reads

    The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures

    It clearly says against unreasonable searches, not against any searches. We can argue all day about what is or isnt unreasonable I suppose but in the end it is subject to interpretation. To me, if you are walking around in public, acting, dressing or in any way trying to intimidate or portray yourself as a criminal then checking you for a weapon is not unreasonable. If you are in public acting high then checking you for drugs is not unreasonable. And seeing as how I do not see these activities as unreasonable I do not see it as a violation of the 4th amendment.

    Look at the number they point out in the article. 1.9% of people searched had weapons. that is almost 1 in 50. Getting those guns off the streets is a great step in the right direction and I applaud this effort.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
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