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Thread: AP sources: Immunity offered to certain immigrants

  1. #261
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    Re: AP sources: Immunity offered to certain immigrants

    Quote Originally Posted by mike2810 View Post
    If a non citizen enters the US through lawful means, they are not illegal. Your statement makes no sense.
    If someone enters lawfully but overstays their visa, then they are here illegally but it is not a criminal violation. What is criminal is entering without permission.

    Either way, Article II doesn't specify that a reprieve is limited to criminal matters.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: AP sources: Immunity offered to certain immigrants

    It seems that the AZ immigration decision has given further support to Obama's policy:

    Congress has specified which aliens may be removed from the United States and the procedures for doing so. Aliens may be removed if they were inadmissible at the time of entry, have been convicted of certain crimes, or meet other criteria set by federal law. See §1227. Removal is a civil, not criminal, matter. A principal feature of the removal system is the broad discretion exercised by immigration officials. See Brief for Former Commissioners of the United States Immigration and Naturalization Service as Amici Curiae 8–13 (hereinafter Brief for Former INS Commissioners).

    …Discretion in the enforcement of immigration law embraces immediate human concerns. Unauthorized workers trying to support their families, for example, likely pose less danger than alien smugglers or aliens who commit a serious crime. The equities of an individual case may turn on many factors, including whether the alien has children born in the United States, long ties to the community, or a record of distinguished military service.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

  3. #263
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    Re: AP sources: Immunity offered to certain immigrants

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    I never said it did. Just pointing out that prices will indeed increase and the labor cost isn't just a small fraction of the costs for farmers.
    This may be true for certain crops requiring more manual labor than others. But we pay lower food bills and make up the difference in extra state benefits for these people.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  4. #264
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    Re: AP sources: Immunity offered to certain immigrants

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Your lord and savior Reagan did it. Conservatives really are hypocrites.
    This is what annoys me, the thought that since a conservative did it, that we agree with it. It is simply untrue.

    Take Romney and Obama for example. Neither of them have a plan I 100% agree with but those are the choices available. Which ever one I choose is not a 100% endorsement of every single one of their policies, its just me saying if I am going to get punched in the face or stomach, I choose stomach.

    I oppose any policy that allows people to circumvent our legal immigration system regardless of which president it was.
    Last edited by Paratrooper; 06-25-12 at 02:11 PM.

  5. #265
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    Re: AP sources: Immunity offered to certain immigrants

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    If someone enters lawfully but overstays their visa, then they are here illegally but it is not a criminal violation. What is criminal is entering without permission.
    That's true, though it shouldn't be. The only penalties are civil and deportation (with the chance of future visa denial). Should be, overstay for longer than 3 months, it's a criminal violation.

  6. #266
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    Re: AP sources: Immunity offered to certain immigrants

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    It seems that the AZ immigration decision has given further support to Obama's policy:
    maybe so, misguided as it is. So tell me, will the feds start paying the costs States incurr when dealing with illegal aliens? Should hospitials send the bill to the feds, should the State bill the feds for the education of illegal aliens? It is a federal issue to deal with, not a State issue.

  7. #267
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    Re: AP sources: Immunity offered to certain immigrants

    Quote Originally Posted by mike2810 View Post
    maybe so, misguided as it is. So tell me, will the feds start paying the costs States incurr when dealing with illegal aliens? Should hospitials send the bill to the feds, should the State bill the feds for the education of illegal aliens? It is a federal issue to deal with, not a State issue.
    I think that the Feds should pay more to states with bigger immigration issues. As a rule the federal government makes money from illegals because many pay payroll taxes but can't collect benefits. The states, OTOH, end up losing money. The Feds should make up the difference.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

  8. #268
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    Re: AP sources: Immunity offered to certain immigrants

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    I think that the Feds should pay more to states with bigger immigration issues. As a rule the federal government makes money from illegals because many pay payroll taxes but can't collect benefits. The states, OTOH, end up losing money. The Feds should make up the difference.
    Good God, we finally agreed on something. I see the sky falling.

    It would be good to see but the divide in Washington, this won't happen. I think States like AZ should push the issue now that the SC has ruled.

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