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Thread: North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax

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    Re: North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    So why is your state broke, and North Dakota has hundreds of billions in surplus revenue?
    1) State Bank-Even the most liberal states do not have this (we are the only state in the country). By the time the rest of the national economy crashed, the State-owned Bank did not engage in risky deals or investments. We were in large part spared the economic woes when the housing market crashed.
    2) Conservative budgeting->Fiscal hawks (of both Republican and Democratic Parties) control both the state legislature and have prominent seats in the Senate and the House, and a somewhat solid to moderate conservative Governor (s).
    3) Great contribution to intake percentage. For every dollar we sent to the country, we pull in $1.25. This is much to do with our influence in the federal government.
    4) Oil Boom.

    Some can be duplicated elsewhere in the country, but we are an exceptionalist state. It would be next to impossible to sell the idea of a State-owned bank elsewhere. It will be difficult to argue for the incredibly conservative fiscal policies (with exception to agriculture) here to be exported to liberal states, especially those with different populations and demographics and social service policies that have been in place for a great deal of time.

    You can't exactly plop North Dakota politics and its budget onto other states and call it good.
    Last edited by Fiddytree; 06-14-12 at 05:58 PM.
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    Re: North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Rosie1 View Post
    Thank goodness my state is a "progressive" state!
    A State Bank for Oregon » Oregon Working Families Party

    wapublicbankproject.org - Bank of North Dakota

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_463522.html

    That's funny. I'm curious why the progressives in your region and elsewhere envy us so if we are such stupid, backwards people.
    Last edited by Fiddytree; 06-14-12 at 06:23 PM.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Gina View Post
    But it's not all roses and champagne for the people already living in the state, as Fiddy has pointed out. Housing shortages, congested roads, people who can't afford new housing because it's priced for those with the new higher paying wages, or existing housing because of the increased demand. It takes time for the infrastructure to catch up and for those who already have jobs, their wages will have to rise, or they move because they cannot afford housing in those areas most greatly effected by the boom. Not everyone in a boom town, or state, has a positive view of it, for reasons like these.

    I'm not saying we shouldn't have economic growth, but it's not all good news and there are unforeseen consequences.


    And...



    And as you posted above to Fiddy:


    It does sop up much of it,certainly to begin with, so the oil money is not the end all, be all to economic problems. Again, I'm not down on economic growth or developing industries, but to say it's all good, is a mistake.
    To tell you the truth if I was an ND resident living in a quiet little town and then this oil boom happened I would be bummed out big time. I am speaking purely on an economy level and the oil boom is nothing but good for the economy.

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    Re: North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    To tell you the truth if I was an ND resident living in a quiet little town and then this oil boom happened I would be bummed out big time. I am speaking purely on an economy level and the oil boom is nothing but good for the economy.
    I would be thinking about what money I could make, and where I could retire when the boom was over. That plot of land just over the hill you always had your eye on.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aberration View Post
    I would be thinking about what money I could make, and where I could retire when the boom was over. That plot of land just over the hill you always had your eye on.
    Depends. Rent is costly, housing scarce, and you are probably going to be busting your balls with less access to your family. Truckers are pissing in bottles because they want money, and wrecks are a big worry. Then youd be contemplating leaving your career for the boom which can equalize in a short time.
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    Re: North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    This kind of prosperity could be going on across America if Obama wasn’t so anti fossil fuel and blue states that use so much fossil fuel wouldn’t refuse to drill in their own back yards. We could be in a boom instead of a bust, nice work left wingers


    North Dakota voters will decide Tuesday on the ultimate tax revolt: abolishing the property tax altogether. A citizen-led petition drive has put the daring, all-or-nothing proposal before the voters in a state flush with tax revenue, jobs and prosperity generated by an oil boom.

    North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax
    From the article

    Measure 2, as the proposal is called on the ballot, would require state government to make up for property tax revenue lost by local governments but doesn't specify how.
    If the economic boom is going to make up the differences, why does the measure require the state government to make up the revenue? I don't have a good feeling about this.

    If they can cut taxes without just creating a deficit, fantastic and wonderful and go for it, but cutting taxes for the sake of cutting taxes isn't smart financial policy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    From the article



    If the economic boom is going to make up the differences, why does the measure require the state government to make up the revenue? I don't have a good feeling about this.

    If they can cut taxes without just creating a deficit, fantastic and wonderful and go for it, but cutting taxes for the sake of cutting taxes isn't smart financial policy
    Don't worry it wasn't passed.
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    Re: North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    property taxes are infinitely more just than income taxes... so yeah, they should have shot for getting rid of income taxes

    a missed opportunity for sure...
    I wish people would do a better job of supporting their points. Please explain why property taxes are infinitely more just than income taxes.

    I certainly beg to differ, as income taxes only arise when there is income (cash flow), so the means to pay them is evident. Property taxes are assessed on an illiquid asset. If someone is a long resident of an area where property values increase they often find themselves in the position of having to sell their home (or farm) because they have no means to pay the property tax.

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    Re: North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    I wish people would do a better job of supporting their points. Please explain why property taxes are infinitely more just than income taxes.

    I certainly beg to differ, as income taxes only arise when there is income (cash flow), so the means to pay them is evident. Property taxes are assessed on an illiquid asset. If someone is a long resident of an area where property values increase they often find themselves in the position of having to sell their home (or farm) because they have no means to pay the property tax.
    I agree, as property taxation is simply unending and increasing rent owed to the gov't.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: North Dakota voters to decide on abolishing property tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    From the article



    If the economic boom is going to make up the differences, why does the measure require the state government to make up the revenue? I don't have a good feeling about this.

    If they can cut taxes without just creating a deficit, fantastic and wonderful and go for it, but cutting taxes for the sake of cutting taxes isn't smart financial policy
    I am against property tax on principle. Property tax means you really don’t own your property, the state does. It is also an unfair tax because people that rent get a free ride. In the depression many lost their homes where they could have had a garden, chickens etc. and ended up in soup lines because they couldn’t pay their taxes. The same is happening now; people are homeless because they couldn’t pay the state. It is no better than the feudal system and makes us serfs.

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