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Thread: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

  1. #51
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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    So your going to vote for Romney then? Just askin.
    Why would I vote for Romney? He supported the war in Iraq, thought the president withdrew the troops to early from Iraq, thinks the president is withdrawing troops too soon from Afghanistan, and thinks we should increase spending on the military.
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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Why would I vote for Romney? He supported the war in Iraq, thought the president withdrew the troops to early from Iraq, thinks the president is withdrawing troops too soon from Afghanistan, and thinks we should increase spending on the military.
    If you say so. if you have cable and get G4 TV look for a show called "Bomb Patrol in Afghanistan". The Obama administration has soldiers risking their lives picking up pressure plates from IED's to collect evidence instead of just blowing them up. What kind of jackass commander in chief do we have? Evidence, WTF are they going to do with it?
    Last edited by Prof. Peabody; 06-11-12 at 04:11 PM.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

  3. #53
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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Our wars have been such a mess since the unconditional surrrenders of World War II because we have made the mistake of using our unprecedented power to add a streak of morality to our military action. Survival has always been about slaughter, not right and wrong.
    The U.S. has historically pursued its interests and cloaked them in idealistic, moralistic, and legalistic language. Its idealistic, moralistic, and legalistic arguments aside, the U.S. had legitimate basis to enter various wars. Two examples are World Wars I and II. WW I and WW II both involved the likely overturning of the global balance of power that, if achieved, would have presented the U.S. with a clear and present danger. Furthermore, in WW II, the U.S. was attacked. The tendency to make moral causes a larger basis for war e.g., calls for the U.S. to use military force in the name of humanitarian principles, is of more recent origins. Ironically, some of its proponents view humanitarian wars as more ethical than wars based on interests, namely national security. I profoundly disagree. Only the latter rises to a level where survival could be undermined.

    Survival has always been about survival. That the means to survive may well have required bloodshed does not automatically mean that warfare is the only means available for the pursuit of survival. In some cases, war is unavoidable and essential. In others, non-military applications can be effective. Too often, those non-military applications have been abandoned prematurely or not given adequate attention in recent years. In turn, the lack of emphasis on diplomacy has actually reduced confidence in diplomacy. Ineffective war outcomes have also eroded confidence in the nation's ability to use its vast power to achieve successful outcomes.

    In the current post-9/11 era, that fundamental reality that war should be a last resort has not changed. Where a hostile or revolutionary state threatens the balance of power in a fashion that would pose a grave threat to U.S. interests and allies, the U.S. needs to be prepared to use force. Iran is a possible case in point, though alternatives involving tougher sanctions to establishing a deterrence regime need to be pursued well before war is even considered. Where political Islamist movements seek power, the situation must be judged carefully based on the character and context of those developments. Not every political Islamist movement poses a credible and imminent threat to the U.S. or its allies, even if some are hostile. The movements that do pose a credible and immiment threat are a subset. It's that subset that needs to be the focus of the nation's national security policy be it through covert action or other counterterrorism activities. Al Qaeda is an example of that subset. As had been the case prior to 9/11, war should remain a last resort.

    Therefore, when it comes to civil conflicts in Syria, Libya, Somalia, etc., where the nation's critical interests and allies e.g., the balance of power, are not threatened, the U.S. should stand aside. The U.S. can and should make its concern for the protection of civilians known. It should not use military force to try to bring about regime change, as it cannot seamlessly transplant functional institutional and political structures. Regime change would bring about a fresh need for nation-building. Attempting another nation-building project could only be time-consuming, costly, and frustrating, especially in an era of looming fiscal constraints.

  4. #54
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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    If you say so. if you have cable and get G4 TV look for a show called "Bomb Patrol in Afghanistan". The Obama administration has soldiers risking their lives picking up pressure plates from IED's to collect evidence instead of just blowing them up. What kind of jackass commander in chief do we have? Evidence, WTF are they going to do with it?
    He's no liberal if that's what you are trying to say. I was never under the illusion that he was. He is just better than the alternative, who is even more hawkish and wants to increase our spending on the military and optional wars that is already equal to almost as much as the rest of the world, COMBINED!

    Romney didn't think the president should have withdrawn our troops from Iraq last year!
    Last edited by Catawba; 06-11-12 at 04:28 PM.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    He's no liberal if that's what you are trying to say.
    No, I'm trying to say he's dumb as a bag of hammers.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    No, I'm trying to say he's dumb as a bag of hammers.
    Well, you failed to make the case that he was dumber than the alternative.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Well, you failed to make the case that he was dumber than the alternative.
    Well maybe to you, but having solders in a war zone gather evidence as if it matters some how is still dumb as a bag of hammers to me.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    Well maybe to you, but having solders in a war zone gather evidence as if it matters some how is still dumb as a bag of hammers to me.
    To me supporting the war in Iraq where almost 5,000 died unnecessarily is a lot dumber.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    To me supporting the war in Iraq where almost 5,000 died unnecessarily is a lot dumber.
    I'm sure you mean equally as dumb. Obama could have had them out of Afghanistan by Sept 2009.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

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    Re: French troop pullout from Afghanistan to start in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    Obama could have had them out of Afghanistan by Sept 2009.
    True, but Romney thinks Obama's schedule for withdrawal is too soon just as he thought was Obama's withdrawal from Iraq was too soon.

    Like in 08, I will go with the least hawkish of the viable candidates.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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