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Thread: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

  1. #171
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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Absolutely. How about you? Got that smoking gun showing that Holder approved this mission?

    Now now, how can I have any evidence on what AG Holder approved/disapproved in the gun running case? Since out of 70+K memos/emails AG Holder has in his possision he has only provided about 7+K to Congress. I think that Congress is about to hold him in contempt for not supplying said evidence, yes? Thus that means I wouldn't have it, yes? Remember the thread is about "grilling" Holder over Fast and Furious.


    But you can provide your proof. Thanks.

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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    no one died because of negligent federal action (or inaction)
    Bull****. The very fact that they let those guns walk after the first program failed is THE contributing factor, it was a F&F GUN with a F&F SERIAL NUMBER. You have no future credibility.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Bull****. The very fact that they let those guns walk after the first program failed is THE contributing factor, it was a F&F GUN with a F&F SERIAL NUMBER. You have no future credibility.
    and you have no reason to whine

    ... unless you can present an argument that but for the availability of the walked weapon that agent would still be alive
    and that is one you are without the ability to make
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  4. #174
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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    and you have no reason to whine

    ... unless you can present an argument that but for the availability of the walked weapon that agent would still be alive
    and that is one you are without the ability to make
    You don't even get it. If a civilian hands a KNOWN criminal or otherwise facilitates that criminal's possession of a gun they own as much of the crime committed as the actual shooter, regardless of whether they "could have gotten one elsewhere". Upholding the law isn't "whining" if anything, whining is the pathetic attempts to dismiss a multitude of FELONIES committed by the nations highest ranking legal officer.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  5. #175
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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    no one died because of negligent federal action (or inaction)
    no rational person would believe the person who killed the agent would not have otherwise been armed

    so, you guys have moved from holder lied
    to its Obama's fault (even tho the shrub started the motion)
    to we did not monitor the assault weapons in mexico
    to an agent died because this weapon was available (and presumably, there were no other weapons available)

    again, don't stop
    this weak pin the tail on the donkey attempt is quite amusing
    The DOJ (and all federal law enforcement) has a simple job, find and arrest criminals. Many like the "bigger fish" idea, letting peons commit crime hoping to find the next level in an organized crime gang, its easier (and safer) than trying to get an undercover agent in the loop. I personally do not agree with it, since it treats the crime victims of the peons as "necessary collateral damage".

    The issue with fast and fuzzy, to me, is that there was no "big fish" involved. As with the drugs, it makes no sense to let 1,000 street dealers wipe each other out (with others in the crossfire), just to try to find out who "Mr. Big" is. The "big guy" is not going to pay using a personal check or CC, its a cash game using anonymous mules, untracable cash and pre-arrainged drops.

    This was a political ploy to try to get tougher gun laws enacted by providing "proof" that US weapons are "critical" to the cartels violence. As even you can see, it was insane to simply watch crime being committed, yet make no effort to stop it, people were killed as a result.

    Sure the weapons were available from other sources, but why pay any LEO to watch crime and not stop it? That is what the Holder deal is all about - WHY were these LEOs told NOT to do their jobs? I will gladly take a federal check from the DOJ to be a "very special, special agent" and I will promise not to arrest anybody, ever, and not to tell anybody why either, ever. ;-)
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 06-12-12 at 09:22 PM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  6. #176
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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Bull****. The very fact that they let those guns walk after the first program failed is THE contributing factor, it was a F&F GUN with a F&F SERIAL NUMBER. You have no future credibility.
    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    The problem is he did have a weapon allowed across the border by the Obama administration. It's a matter of culpability. If I provided that same gun and they traced it back to me I'd be prosecuted. Why should Obama administration officials be exempt?

    Your wasting your time. This one will continue to deny till Holder goes to jail....and he will.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

  7. #177
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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    and you have no reason to whine

    ... unless you can present an argument that but for the availability of the walked weapon that agent would still be alive
    and that is one you are without the ability to make

    Here's a fact: If the federal gun running program, under the Obama Admin and AG Holder had not happened, the federal agent would still be alive.

  8. #178
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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    Your wasting your time. This one will continue to deny till Holder goes to jail....and he will.

    And then will most likely say that he was jailed wrongly. Earlier in the thread I was informed by a lib that the Plame leak came out of Cheney's office, when we know it was Richard Armitage....misinformation, and sticking to the liberal narrative is nearly a religious equivalent with these people.


    j-mac
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  9. #179
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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy the Kid View Post
    Here's a fact: If the federal gun running program, under the Obama Admin and AG Holder had not happened, the federal agent would still be alive.
    that's a bold piece of bull crap you are standing on
    as if the person who shot the agent would not have otherwise had another weapon to inflict the same mortal wound
    try again
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  10. #180
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    Re: Eric Holder grilled over Fast and Furious in Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    that's a bold piece of bull crap you are standing on
    as if the person who shot the agent would not have otherwise had another weapon to inflict the same mortal wound
    try again

    Ok, using your own standard, please provide evidence that the same person who shot Agent Terry that night would have had another firearm. Where he would have got it. Or, that Terry and he would have even crossed paths given any change in circumstance.

    See, you callously set up a logical fallacy argument, then refuse to even say that it was wrong for this program to have been in place, and was responsible for the death of a Federal Border Agent.

    Is your ideological alignment more important that being a stand up human yourself and showing a little empathy for the Agent killed, or his family?

    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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