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Thread: Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

  1. #961
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    Re: Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    From your link “Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker has officially taken away nearly all collective bargaining rights from the vast majority of the state's public employees.”

    Does ‘nearly all’ equate to ‘eliminate’?

    Further reading:

    As for the other public employees -- a much larger group that includes schoolteachers, local government workers and about half of 76,000 state employees -- the bill would allow collective bargaining only on a base pay rate (not overtime or special pay issues), and on raises only within the rate of inflation. That means no bargaining on fringe benefits, working conditions, outsourcing, safety and other issues.
    PolitiFact Wisconsin | Wisconsin AFL-CIO says Gov. Scott Walker

    It would appear that Walker DID NOT ELIMINATE collective bargaining rights for ALL public workers but HE DID SOME OF THEM…can we stipulate to that?
    Go yammer semantics with someone else. He effectively eliminated collective bargaining.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Go yammer semantics with someone else. He effectively eliminated collective bargaining.
    You modify your position from 'eliminated' to 'effectively eliminated' and want ME to 'yammer semantics with someone else', thank you for that...Ok, moving on...

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    Re: Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Go yammer semantics with someone else. He effectively eliminated collective bargaining.
    The only bargaining rights that were eliminated was the ability to negotiate how much they get paid and how much benefits they get. All other forms of collective bargaining is still freely available.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    You wanna talk about "Wise Ass Things"... dude when you make outrageous claims about how liberals are destroying the country you've earned all the wise assness you're gonna get
    Well, just as liberals made such sweeping generalizations, and still do of conservatives, I do indeed think that liberal/progressives are out to literally destroy America as it exists today. They don't like it, they are ashamed of it, ie Bill Press. They think America is an ignoble, stolen, unfair, imperialistic, enclave of bitter failure. And they think that if they could just do away with freedom, and capitalism then everything can be equal and fair, like some Star Trek episode from the 70s.

    These are the hippies that didn't get their way then, teaching a new generation of selfish, belligerent, arrogant, misguided youth into a pipe dream that never has, and never will exist. It always ends in dictatorship and ruin.

    You don't feel perhaps it's a little arrogant to "MY COUNTRY" like you own it or like your sides opinion is the only one that's valid?
    No. I think it's arrogant to say that the Constitution is a charter of negative liberties.

    I think it's arrogant to demonize success, and praise dependence.

    I think it's arrogant to tell me that I am in debt to someone else simply because I work, and they don't.

    I think it's arrogant to enter a discussion for the sole purpose of setting a premise of agree with me or you're stupid (not you specific mind you)...

    I think it's arrogant to think that Americans are too stupid to understand, and recognize when an ideology is bent on tearing down what we were founded on for a promise of 'fundamental transformation' without ever being clear what that transformation is transforming to.

    I think a lot is arrogant.


    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    The only bargaining rights that were eliminated was the ability to negotiate how much they get paid and how much benefits they get. All other forms of collective bargaining is still freely available.
    And what's wrong with each individual employee negotiating their own pay and benefits? I've done just fine negotiating on my own. Who needs a union?
    Last edited by The Man; 06-09-12 at 11:51 PM.

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    Re: Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    And what's wrong with each individual employee negotiating their own pay and benefits? I've done just fine negotiating on my own. Who needs a union?
    Never said that it is wrong for individuals to negotiate their own pay. Where did you get that?
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Never said that it is wrong for individuals to negotiate their own pay. Where did you get that?
    Ahh, well then I misunderstood you, sorry! I thought that you were hinting that taking away collective bargaining rights for pay and benefits is a bad thing.

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    Re: Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    Again, Walker did not bust any union. Being fiscally responsible and balancing the state budget is NOT union busting. Are public labor unions no longer allowed to exist in Wisconsin? I'm pretty sure that even if the whole point of the labor union is only to get together to go bowling every Friday, or have a barbecue twice a week, labor unions are allowed to exist.

    But, even if candidates can't receive out of state money in the future, does it really matter? If no candidate can receive out of state funding, then it's still an even playing field, no?

    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

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    Re: Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    The only bargaining rights that were eliminated was the ability to negotiate how much they get paid and how much benefits they get. All other forms of collective bargaining is still freely available.
    Is that all?!
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Is that all?!
    Yep. They can still bargain for extra hours, less hours, safety, and anything else you can imagine. Just not for pay raises and better benefits.

    One more thing that I did forget to mention is that it does not apply to the police unions or the firefighter unions. They still have their FULL collective bargaining capabilities.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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