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Thread: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Hmm, what has it done for us...? It's provided a national security, killed OBL and Qaddafi, provided food and sustenance to the unemployed and elderly, maintained our highways, kept the planes in the air, lowered unemployment, increased GDP....

    Or was that a rhetorical question?
    And he fed his dog too ...........

    Greece dug an uber-deep hole. Their party is over. They have to fix their system, and suck it up.

    If you want to see an example of austerity success, look to Warren G. Harding.

    Harding appointed Charlie Dawes, known for being an effective financier, as the first director of the Bureau of the Budget. Dawes reduced government spending by $1.5 billion his first year as director, a 25% reduction, along with another 25% reduction the following year. In effect, the Government budget was nearly cut in ˝ in just two years.[115] Harding believed the federal government should be fiscally managed similar to the private sector having campaigned "Less government in business and more business in government."[116] "Harding was true to his word, carrying on budget cuts that had begun under a debilitated Woodrow Wilson. Federal spending declined from $6.3 billion in 1920 to $5 billion in 1921 and $3.3 billion in 1922. Tax rates, meanwhile, were slashed—for every income group. And over the course of the 1920s, the national debt was reduced by one third."


    On March 4, President Harding assumed office while the nation was in the midst of a postwar economic decline, known as the Depression of 1920–21. By summer of his first year in office, an economic recovery began.

    President Harding convened the Conference of Unemployment in 1921, headed by Secretary of Commerce Herbert Hoover, that proactively advocated stimulating the economy with local public work projects and encouraged businesses to apply shared work programs.[120]

    Harding's Treasury Secretary, Andrew Mellon, ordered a study that claimed to demonstrate that as income tax rates were increased, money was driven underground or abroad. Mellon concluded that lower rates would increase tax revenues. Based on this advice, Harding cut taxes, starting in 1922. The top marginal rate was reduced annually in four stages from 73% in 1921 to 25% in 1925. Taxes were cut for lower incomes starting in 1923.[121]

    Revenues to the treasury increased substantially. Unemployment also continued to fall. Libertarian historian Thomas Woods contends that the tax cuts ended the Depression of 1920–1921 — even though economic growth had begun before the cuts—and were responsible for creating a decade-long expansion.[117] Historians Schweikart and Allen attribute these changes to the tax cuts.[122] Schweikart and Allen also argue that Harding's tax and economic policies in part "... produced the most vibrant eight year burst of manufacturing and innovation in the nation's history."[123] The combined declines in unemployment and inflation (later known as the Misery Index) were among the sharpest in U.S. history. Wages, profits, and productivity all made substantial gains during the 1920s.

    Warren G. Harding - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    I do not believe that any here are advocating cutting the budget by 25%. But what the liberals are fighting against is a policy such as limiting its growth to 1% per year for a decade. That will get private investment, and expansion, back into the economy. Trillions of dollars of such. Spent far more wisely than such as Obama has demonstrated. Adn yes, Bush was a lousy steward of the economy as well.

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    The most idiotic part of the argument - and purely political - is that if we increase tax rates on the 3 percent of Americans that make over $200,000 a year, that will make a big dent.

    It would be like spitting in the ocean. It would do nothing.

    Half of Americans pay no federal taxes at all. Entitlements paid to buy votes from that half of people eat up billions of dollars a year. Some of the most influential states (California, Illinois, and New York) are run entirely based on those principles because their citizenry is addicted to it.

    What Scott Walker did is the first step to what the real problem is. Whether we have the stomach to elect the right people to fix the problem is doubtful at best.

    America is fast-tracking the way of California, which is bankrupt beyond repair.

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Eighty Deuce View Post
    And he fed his dog too ...........

    Greece dug an uber-deep hole. Their party is over. They have to fix their system, and suck it up.

    If you want to see an example of austerity success, look to Warren G. Harding.



    I do not believe that any here are advocating cutting the budget by 25%. But what the liberals are fighting against is a policy such as limiting its growth to 1% per year for a decade. That will get private investment, and expansion, back into the economy. Trillions of dollars of such. Spent far more wisely than such as Obama has demonstrated. Adn yes, Bush was a lousy steward of the economy as well.
    Excellent link to Harding.

    But I am DEFINITELY advocating cutting the U.S. federal budget by 25% - at least.

    I say balance the budget in two years; not by raising taxes, but by cutting expenditures.

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Eighty Deuce View Post
    And he fed his dog too ...........

    Greece dug an uber-deep hole. Their party is over. They have to fix their system, and suck it up.

    If you want to see an example of austerity success, look to Warren G. Harding.



    I do not believe that any here are advocating cutting the budget by 25%. But what the liberals are fighting against is a policy such as limiting its growth to 1% per year for a decade. That will get private investment, and expansion, back into the economy. Trillions of dollars of such. Spent far more wisely than such as Obama has demonstrated. Adn yes, Bush was a lousy steward of the economy as well.
    Ironically, Obama has limited spending growth to about 1% per year. I think that is a good policy, but not now. Not when the economy is in danger of backsliding into recession.

    Harding, of course, oversaw a period of immense income inequality, and helped set the stage for the Great Depression.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    The most idiotic part of the argument - and purely political - is that if we increase tax rates on the 3 percent of Americans that make over $200,000 a year, that will make a big dent.

    It would be like spitting in the ocean. It would do nothing.

    Half of Americans pay no federal taxes at all. Entitlements paid to buy votes from that half of people eat up billions of dollars a year. Some of the most influential states (California, Illinois, and New York) are run entirely based on those principles because their citizenry is addicted to it.

    What Scott Walker did is the first step to what the real problem is. Whether we have the stomach to elect the right people to fix the problem is doubtful at best.

    America is fast-tracking the way of California, which is bankrupt beyond repair.
    Simply not true. Eliminating the top tax cuts alone isn't enough, but it would reduce deficits by about a trillion dollars over 10 years, which is hardly inconsequential.

    When the economy is sound we should at minimum eliminate all of the Bush tax cuts. By itself that would halt the growth of the debt. Then, of course, we should reform entitlements and cut military spending.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    It's the classic penny wise, pound foolish philosophy. We think we're being smart by pinching pennies now, but we are actually blowing a huge opportunity that will cost future generations more in the long run. See Herbert Hoover.
    These are not guaranteed opportunities. They have risks associated with them and could lose more than they gain. The Federal government needs to stop its spending. We are already costing are future generations unbelievable amounts of money.

    To be frank, when we die, we will have left this country worse off than when we inherited it.
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Simply not true. Eliminating the top tax cuts alone isn't enough, but it would reduce deficits by about a trillion dollars over 10 years, which is hardly inconsequential.

    When the economy is sound we should at minimum eliminate all of the Bush tax cuts. By itself that would halt the growth of the debt. Then, of course, we should reform entitlements and cut military spending.
    So when people finally start to see the light, we should tax the piss out of them.

    Now there's some sound thinking.

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue_State View Post
    These are not guaranteed opportunities. They have risks associated with them and could lose more than they gain. The Federal government needs to stop its spending. We are already costing are future generations unbelievable amounts of money.

    To be frank, when we die, we will have left this country worse off than when we inherited it.
    There is very little risk in repairing or replacing infrastructure that needs repair or replacement. We're pissing away a historic opportunity.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    There is very little risk in repairing or replacing infrastructure that needs repair or replacement. We're pissing away a historic opportunity.
    I agree. Infrastructure needs repair...repair it. I understand the need, I am all for the spending of money to repair infrastucture. It is when the money isn't used for that very reason I have issues. Corporate Welfare and such.
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

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    Re: US Debt Could Double in 25 Years With Current Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Ironically, Obama has limited spending growth to about 1% per year. I think that is a good policy, but not now. Not when the economy is in danger of backsliding into recession.

    Harding, of course, oversaw a period of immense income inequality, and helped set the stage for the Great Depression.
    Hey. I'm not buying that rubbish about Obama. That debate has been had. Those statistics phoney as Hell. Passing off Obama spending on Bush is hilariously stupid.

    The Depression was a stock bubble burst. And a Recession. FDR made it a Depression.

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