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Thread: Vermont first state to ban fracking

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    You are probably correct.

    I say let's deal with these issues also. I don't see how this affects concerns about fracking. Aren't we, as a society, able to deal with multiple things simultaneously?

    We can walk and chew gum at the same time.
    We've yet to prove that actually. Our government is so inefficient/ineffective that they can't manage to do one thing at a time other than of course screwing stuff up.

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    Quote Originally Posted by ChuckBerry View Post
    The whole point of hydraulic fracturing is to increase the permeability of rocks to release the natural gas in them, often with high pressure fluids. Those fluids are making it easier for themselves to get out into the broader rock formations. Through the process of chemical osmosis, areas with a high concentration of a given substance will tend to migrate to an area of lesser concentration, and the osmotic process can create pressures of its own. I don't see why anyone would think that it wouldn't be at least possible that chemicals used in fracking could make their way in to local groundwater.
    Osmosis would require a permeable surface to move through. Considering the fracking process is done under over a mile of impermeable cap rock is why this situation is not possible. It is also why natural gas from these formations does not simply percolate to the surface.

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    The main place where contamination of gw is possible is from disposal of frack flowback and it is already regulated by the SDWA.

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    Do you think someone who makes their money by drilling oil wells would be objective concerning issues that could end their business?
    And, by "objective" you mean, "agree with everything you're saying", regardless of what my knowledge and experience tell me?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    Quote Originally Posted by drz-400 View Post
    Osmosis would require a permeable surface to move through. Considering the fracking process is done under over a mile of impermeable cap rock is why this situation is not possible. It is also why natural gas from these formations does not simply percolate to the surface.
    That fact goes right over the heads of some folks. Amazing!
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Well, then do your own research. It's not my job to prove your point for you.
    Because you cannot.

    Here in Michigan we have had two different lobbyists come to our State Rep office and push for a vote on easing fracking regulations. They tell us that the companies have certain proprietary rights that allow them to keep this information secret - even from the State.

    So you could not prove your point if you even wanted to. The information is simply not available to any of us.

    We are allowing companies to put chemicals in the ground and we have no real idea how much of each they are putting in nor can we then do any study of their possible effect because we have no idea what to study.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Because you cannot.

    Here in Michigan we have had two different lobbyists come to our State Rep office and push for a vote on easing fracking regulations. They tell us that the companies have certain proprietary rights that allow them to keep this information secret - even from the State.

    So you could not prove your point if you even wanted to. The information is simply not available to any of us.

    We are allowing companies to put chemicals in the ground and we have no real idea how much of each they are putting in nor can we then do any study of their possible effect because we have no idea what to study.
    Again, you fail to do your own research. Color me surprised. Maybe you can try YahooAnswers, it seems to be your favorite source.

    And, now, we're just supposed to take your word for all this. What makes you think you can possibly have that much credibility.
    Last edited by apdst; 05-19-12 at 06:23 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Again, you fail to do your own research. Color me surprised. Maybe you can try YahooAnswers, it seems to be your favorite source.

    And, now, we're just supposed to take your word for all this. What makes you think you can possibly have that much credibility.
    You've already been slapped down on this same point at least twice. You're like the energizer bobo.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Because you cannot.

    Here in Michigan we have had two different lobbyists come to our State Rep office and push for a vote on easing fracking regulations. They tell us that the companies have certain proprietary rights that allow them to keep this information secret - even from the State.

    So you could not prove your point if you even wanted to. The information is simply not available to any of us.

    We are allowing companies to put chemicals in the ground and we have no real idea how much of each they are putting in nor can we then do any study of their possible effect because we have no idea what to study.
    Halliburton - Fluids Disclosure

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    Re: Vermont first state to ban fracking

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Again, you fail to do your own research. Color me surprised. Maybe you can try YahooAnswers, it seems to be your favorite source.

    And, now, we're just supposed to take your word for all this. What makes you think you can possibly have that much credibility.
    All you have to do is present your data right here. But you are impotent to do that.

    Fracking companies hold their formulas close as proprietary secrets. We have no idea what it is they are putting in the ground in what quantities and what the long term effect is.

    But by all means do prove me wrong and show us all right here.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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