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Thread: Mexico is just getting worse

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    Are they producing? Why not?
    they are producing all right there are just producing the wrong stuff (due to not being industrialised enough) I would love to go into a potted history of the economic development of Northern and Southern Europe respectively but i struggle to see how this links to their drugs policy.

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    A good place to start reducing the influence of drug cartels would be to limit their current competitive advantage in the US. How? Legalize marijuana. I've seen different numbers on this, but let's say that 40% of cross-border drug trafficking consists of marijuana imports to the US. If marijuana were suddenly made legal and regulated, the drug cartels would lose 40% of their income to legitimate, probably US domestic businesses. That would cut their legs right out from under them.
    I would add to that; make a good immigration policy for the land of immigrants. One that helps people follow our laws while still immigrating.
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    There was a time when cigarettes were being used by almost everyone in the country. A large majority of Americans drink regularly. Do you know how ****ed up being belief a person's life would become if they were using meth and heroin a few times a week like people consume alcohol?
    And yet there were still teetotalers and people who never smoked in their life.

    Just because people have a choice in using something doesn't mean they will always choose to do it.

    The price of giving people that choice is less that the price we pay in blood and gold trying to take that choice away from them.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Ah, yes, always the simple liberal answer.

    Can you imagine how unproductive much of our citizenry would become if they could take drugs at will, and companies could no longer screen for them when hiring?

    "Hey, Hal, what'd you do this weekend?"

    "Not much. Shot heroine on Saturday night, so I was pretty catatonic all day Sunday. Totally missed work on Monday, dude."
    Except alcohol is legal, and companies are able to fire people for showing up to work when they're drunk.

    Same with other recreational drugs. If an employee shows up for work while intoxicated - no matter what that intoxicant is - they can be fired for it.

    Just like they are now.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Though Mexican history is interesting...it does not matter in the current situation. The massive and abrupt change in dynamics is 100% drug related.

    They can make a lot of money by getting it here (an elsewhere ), and so they resort to massive violence to make as much money as they can.

    We, Here, no longer accept violence means to make money, but we once did.

    In Mexico....they still do. Let them kill each other like we did, eventually they will come around.

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    The legalazation of something would likely peak the interested in a lot of people, especially when they are out partying on a Friday night and stop into 711 when they are drunk and high on weed and can pick up some meth and herion. There are very few meth heads, crack heads, ect that are productive in any society. We don't need to be taking hard working Americans and helping them turn into junkies. We need to be doing the opposite. The value of making these substances illegal is because they have been proven to take over a persons life even when initially used recreationally and destroy it completely. Can you name any benefits of legalizing meth?
    Yes. The benefits of legalizing meth is that we will spend less money for police, prisons, and the court system. Instead, that money can be used for rehabilitating meth addicts that want it.

    Because they can get rehabilitation rather than a prison sentence, they won't be considered a felon. Therefore they won't be automatically dismissed from job interviews for being an ex-convict with a felony on their record. Which will make it easier for them to get a job after they've gotten their life straight.

    Because meth will be legal, companies will be in charge of providing it. As opposed to current manufacturers now - drug criminals. And because legal businesses will resolve conflicts via the court system, rather than through street violence, less drug violence overall will happen.

    Because meth is legal it can be taxed, and thus is a revenue generator for the government and can be used for projects for the general beneficial use of the people. As opposed to right now in which those who sell meth pay no monies to the government, and so enjoys greater profits because of it without being required to give back to society in the form of taxes.

    And those are only the benefits to legalizing meth I can think of off the top of my head. I'm sure I could think of more if I really thought about it.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Do people REALLY believe legalizing marijuana solves this? Hey...Im all for legalizing pot...always have been and NOT to fight the drug war. But the real money is not in pot...its in heroin, and meth, and other smaller, more easily portable drugs. One of the reasons we see reduced meth labs in America is the production and distribution from mexico has gotten so much better and more efficient. So...do we decriminalize ALL drug use? Just stop arresting people? That stops usage...how exactly?
    Will marijuana legalization solve the problem? Probably not. But it will reduce the influence of cartels by robbing them of a significant chunk of their income. You're right, probably, that the profit margins are higher for meth and heroin, but there's also a much smaller market for those drugs. I've seen different estimates as to how much of cartel revenue stems from pot, but it's somewhere between 25%-60%. Even if it's the low end number, a 25% reduction in revenue is a body blow to those organizations.

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    Conversation doesnt stop there.

    Since he missed Monday and was sitting home all day so he went ahead and got high again. Which screwed him over on going to work Tuesday too. That pissed his boss off who suspends him for a few days. So he decides to get high again since he is upset about the suspension. Ultimately leads to him getting fired. Which luckily for him he can fall back on our welfare system till he gets back on his feet. Which could take a while when you have a track record of poor attendance at your previous job and your piss is dirty. And in the job interview your teeth are rotting out of your head and your potentially new boss is watching your cold sweats shakes as you try to think of an answer. In hindsight offering to suck his dick for $20 probably wasnt helpful either. After a long while with this the guy will likely enroll in some type of rehab at the tax payers expense to help him clean up and get off the heroin. During that time he decides he should probably sue the manufacturer who is legally selling it for ruining his life draining our tax money and wasting a courts time. he will likely win because we always hold others accountable here in AMerica for our own failures. With that money he will "celebrate" and the cycle will start again.
    As opposed to what happens to drug addicts now.

    They smoke some pot and get busted for it so they go to jail on a felony drug conviction.

    He's young and doesn't make a lot of money so he can't pay fees for a good lawyer so he makes a deal. Only the prosecutor wants to get elected as governor, so he's a hard ass and makes the kid do jail time.

    So he's imprisoned with hardcore gang members and, just to survive, he is forced to join one. They teach him skills criminals use to make it in the world since he's got nothing better to do. He's also at risk of being assaulted, raped, or murdered.

    He gets out eventually and tries to get a job somewhere. Only he's got a felony drug conviction on his record, and the biggest employers automatically disallow hiring of ex-felons. Which means it's incredibly difficult for him to get a decent basic job.

    But nobody else is going to pay for him to live. He's got to earn. Which means he goes back to the gang that took care of him in prison because, hey, at least they will take care of him. So he earns his way by committing more serious crimes.

    Eventually he gets caught and the cycle continues. Or he winds up dead.

    Either way, it can be argued that people are less productive. But with my way at least there is less violence, especially against innocents.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Its not a popular message...but if you are going to combat certain groups, you have to play on their terms. You have to be ruthless, brutal, merciless. Frankly...most people dont have the stomach to accept the fact, let alone to engage.
    We don't have the money either.

    How much do we really want to pay in taxes to keep people from getting high?
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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    Re: Mexico is just getting worse

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    By that logic if we legalize murders then hitmen would be out of a job. We could legalize rape and put prostitutes out of jobs. You could legalize every crime and then we wouldn't have criminals at all right?
    Murder and rape are crimes because they are impositions of violence against other people.

    When a person chooses to take a recreational drug himself there is no violence against anyone.

    You cannot equate the two.

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    How exactly do you properly regulate a product that is so addictive people will sell their bodies, children, rob, kill, ect to get?
    For one, you can limit the supply to how much people can get at a time. Now will there be people who will get a work-around on this? Yes. But there will also be less violence involved as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    So we should help people get addicted to heroin, meth and crack then pay to help them get off it. Does that really sound productive?
    Legalization of drugs isn't helping people getting addicted to drugs. Not any more than allowing tobacco to be legal to smoke helps people to become smokers. Or not any more than allowing alcohol to be drunk helps people to become alcoholics.

    And treatment for those who want to get help is a more efficient use of resources that trying to stop everyone who wants to use them through the use of violence.

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    If criminals and the like start fighting instead of fighting back we should tuck our tails between our legs and give in? Give in to lawlessness and any resemblence of decency and hope that if we legalize everything that people will eventually grow tired it all? Seriously?
    I think it is more decent to just allow people to use the recreational drugs they want to than to allow the drug trade to stay criminalized so only criminals control it and those who use drugs are put in jail with other criminals whose crimes victimize others. Especially when the latter comes out of taxes that I have to pay for.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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