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Thread: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

  1. #271
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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Only some of us need all the education we can get, not all of us.
    Look around all day tomorrow, how many of the people you interact with in public need a degree to do what they do?
    Two things. First, what you're doing is kind of like saying that you don't need to fish all day, you just need to fish for the three different five minute intervals when you caught fish. We don't have any way to know which people are going to turn out to be able to make the most of their education in advance. Some folks get an advanced degree, then can't find any work except in a coffee shop for a couple years, then they start up their own company or get a research job somewhere. Other folks get high end jobs right out of school. Other folks never do. But the more times you roll the dice the more times they come up sixes.

    Second, you are still just thinking about today. Compare what percentage of jobs today require post-high-school education to the percentage that did 30 years ago. It's easily 2-3 times as many as it was then. That is going to keep happening. In another 30 years, 2-3 times as many jobs as today will require at least a college degree. People who are deciding on their educational path today need to be planning for the job market 30 years from now, not just today.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    The main reason is that they have far more people at that level of education. I used to run the professional services department in a software company. As far back as 2002 or 2003 we started getting applications from people from Asia that had Phds in computer science. We would get like a handful of applications from folks in the US. Maybe one or two would have an undergrad degree with a major in computer science, one or two more would have no degree, but a couple years of work experience with software. And then we'd get a dozen applications from people in Asia with graduate degrees and almost always at least one with a Phd. It was professional services, so lots of working directly with clients, so we strongly preferred to hire Americans who knew the language and culture better, but still, we couldn't pass up that kind of opportunity some of the times. For our engineering department it was a no brainer since they were not client facing, so they loaded up on highly educated, super skilled, programmers from China, Southeast Asia, Pakistan and India.
    Sounds like your company was making educated decisions...as they should be. If someone is more qualified they should get the job. America is losing its get up and go. Good thing America can still import people who want opportunity...oh yeah...we founded a nation on that notion.
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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue_State View Post
    Show me a free PhD. They do not exist.
    How would I show you a free Phd lol? You apply to schools, the schools decide what to offer you if you are accepted. Most folks, at least at high end schools, end up with a free ride.

    Just trust me on it man. I know a lot of people that have gotten Phds and as far as I know, none of them have had to pay much anything for them. Most have to TA classes or be research assistants to cover living expenses, but that's about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue_State View Post
    Who is denying that there are jobs that require advanced education. We do not need to educate as many people as possible. We can't find advanced jobs for the highly educated now. We have people with college degrees that are holding down high school level jobs...or none. Less 50% of college grads last year got a job.
    The notion that you can plan for the educational needs of the next 30 years just based on the unemployment figures of today when we're in a recession is just silly.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue_State View Post
    Sounds like your company was making educated decisions...as they should be. If someone is more qualified they should get the job. America is losing its get up and go. Good thing America can still import people who want opportunity...oh yeah...we founded a nation on that notion.
    YOU are the one losing your get up and go! You want to just give up and let the other countries beat us out by educating their people better... Why? Just seems too exhausting to keep trying or something?
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Two things. First, what you're doing is kind of like saying that you don't need to fish all day, you just need to fish for the three different five minute intervals when you caught fish. We don't have any way to know which people are going to turn out to be able to make the most of their education in advance. Some folks get an advanced degree, then can't find any work except in a coffee shop for a couple years, then they start up their own company or get a research job somewhere. Other folks get high end jobs right out of school. Other folks never do. But the more times you roll the dice the more times they come up sixes.

    Second, you are still just thinking about today. Compare what percentage of jobs today require post-high-school education to the percentage that did 30 years ago. It's easily 2-3 times as many as it was then. That is going to keep happening. In another 30 years, 2-3 times as many jobs as today will require at least a college degree. People who are deciding on their educational path today need to be planning for the job market 30 years from now, not just today.
    yes, we do know how to determine in advance which of us will better use higher education...we just don't do it because of liberal ideas like "no child left behind". We can't generate equal outcome in economics, nor can we generate equal aptitudes in our kids, or equal attitudes for that matter.
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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    yes, we do know how to determine in advance which of us will better use higher education...we just don't do it because of liberal ideas like "no child left behind". We can't generate equal outcome in economics, nor can we generate equal aptitudes in our kids, or equal attitudes for that matter.
    No Child Left Behind is George W. Bush's education plan that liberals hate.

    No, we can't determine who is going to be successful. We can make some educated guesses. We can say this kid definitely isn't and this kid definitely is, but most kids really could go either way. I mean, the bar for somebody who is better off with a college degree than without one is a very low bar. The median income for somebody with a college degree is 65% higher than the median income of somebody with just a high school degree. That is the median, not the average. That means that even the most average guy that graduates college is doing 65% better because of it. Probably 90% or more of college graduates do better because they got the degree. By all means, colleges should have rigorous admissions standards. It is true that some people we can know with a high level of certainty that they're not going to be able to get a college-educated type of job after they graduate. But that's a process of trying to identify the very lowest performers and ruling them out, not a process of trying to identify just the very best.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Second, you are still just thinking about today. Compare what percentage of jobs today require post-high-school education to the percentage that did 30 years ago. It's easily 2-3 times as many as it was then. That is going to keep happening. In another 30 years, 2-3 times as many jobs as today will require at least a college degree. People who are deciding on their educational path today need to be planning for the job market 30 years from now, not just today.
    No, he is thinking long term. Do what he said, go about your day tomorrow, and every place you see someone working, think if they need a degree to do that job.
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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    No Child Left Behind is George W. Bush's education plan that liberals hate.
    liberals such as co-author Ted Kennedy?

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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    liberals such as co-author Ted Kennedy?
    Yeah, they did get some Democrats on board. But is was obviously a Republican thing. It was one of Bush's supposed major legislative achievements. But it turned out to be a disaster. Most liberals were against it all along. Obama is trying to push them to reform it. IMO they should just scrap it.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: A Generation Hobbled by the Soaring Cost of College

    Quote Originally Posted by Arbo View Post
    No, he is thinking long term. Do what he said, go about your day tomorrow, and every place you see someone working, think if they need a degree to do that job.
    Read the whole post before you reply and see if you can come up with a counter argument. If not, don't reply.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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