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Thread: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Honestly Lizzie if a self induced global depression is the only way forward then we're screwed no matter what.
    Yes, we are.
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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    That very well may be true, but it doesn't change the fact that the government took well over half of the savings of every man, woman and child in america. I realize desperate situations require desperate measures (not saying I support it), I was simply explaining to Somerville some of the ways the war was paid for.
    No I agree with you Rabid.....inflation and growth were how we paid of our WWII debt. I also agree that yes....there are ramifications. Inflating your way out of debt isn't rainbows and unicorns. I did want to point out though that inflation on it's own isn't the whole picture.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    Yes, we are.
    Like I said...."the end is nigh".......yawn.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
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    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    Europe is screwed for a lot of reasons, but I personally believe they are better off. They are taking their hit early, and it's horrific for them. We however are pushing it off and propping up our economy with fake money, prolonging the inevitable. I think we're going to crash harder than they did.
    I think the US is still drastically different than the majority of the EU countries. We tax our population less, government spending makes up less as a % of the economy, we are still the global reserve currency. The only problem I see is stagnant or decreasing EU demand causing the US problems. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

    I don't see the US in anyway shape or form comparable to most of the EU countries that are having issues.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    That very well may be true, but it doesn't change the fact that the government took well over half of the savings of every man, woman and child in america. I realize desperate situations require desperate measures (not saying I support it), I was simply explaining to Somerville some of the ways the war was paid for.
    "the government took well over half of the savings of every man, woman and child in america" Care to point me to some sites or books that would support this statement.

    Despite the success of the American economy in the 1950s with a top marginal tax rate of 91%, "confiscatory" in the words of the Friedmanites and Norquist acolytes, the modern right somehow seems to think that returning to the tax rates we knew during the Clinton years would kill the present economy. Somehow despite the fact that the GDP/debt ratio hit 122% in 1947-48 and tax rates were much higher than today, the right continues to promote the idea that lower taxes will provide more stimulation to the economy.

    That 122% number would seem to show the war wasn't "paid" for during the time it occurred.
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    Quote Originally Posted by Somerville View Post
    "the government took well over half of the savings of every man, woman and child in america" Care to point me to some sites or books that would support this statement.

    Despite the success of the American economy in the 1950s with a top marginal tax rate of 91%, "confiscatory" in the words of the Friedmanites and Norquist acolytes, the modern right somehow seems to think that returning to the tax rates we knew during the Clinton years would kill the present economy. Somehow despite the fact that the GDP/debt ratio hit 122% in 1947-48 and tax rates were much higher than today, the right continues to promote the idea that lower taxes will provide more stimulation to the economy.

    That 122% number would seem to show the war wasn't "paid" for during the time it occurred.
    I just explained to you how inflation worked, and provided sources. If you're not going to take the time to educate yourself on it, then there's nothing I can do for you. Iliveonramen has no problem understanding inflation, why do you?
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    I just explained to you how inflation worked, and provided sources. If you're not going to take the time to educate yourself on it, then there's nothing I can do for you. Iliveonramen has no problem understanding inflation, why do you?
    I don't buy your explanation for "how inflation works". Your links didn't show me that "the government took well over half of the savings of every man, woman and child in america"

    You haven't bothered to answer the questions about economic success and GDP growth during times of "confiscatory" tax rates, even though you claim you have.

    I do not believe Iliveonramen agreed with your points.
    Iliveonramen at 12:20PM
    Wage growth out paced the rate of inflation....you're giving a much bleaker depiction of post-World War II than reality. Real wage growth increased all the way until the 1970's. The dollar may of been less but the average individual could still purchase more in 1950 than he could pre 1945.
    Last edited by Somerville; 05-07-12 at 02:47 PM. Reason: add a quote
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    Quote Originally Posted by Somerville View Post
    I don't buy your explanation for "how inflation works". Your links didn't show me that "the government took well over half of the savings of every man, woman and child in america"

    You haven't bothered to answer the questions about economic success and GDP growth during times of "confiscatory" tax rates, even though you claim you have.

    I do not believe Iliveonramen agreed with your points
    Sometimes it pays to read the thread. See below.

    It's not my job to teach you how inflation works, you should be able to look it up yourself.

    It doesn't matter whether you're liberal, conservative, libertarian, democrat or republican, the fact that inflation took place and drastically devalued our currency is a fact. Whether or not it was morally or economically sound is another argument altogether.

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    No I agree with you Rabid.....inflation and growth were how we paid of our WWII debt. I also agree that yes....there are ramifications. Inflating your way out of debt isn't rainbows and unicorns. I did want to point out though that inflation on it's own isn't the whole picture.
    Last edited by RabidAlpaca; 05-07-12 at 03:32 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    And from the IMF Managing Director. Bloomberg.com reported:

    “Austerity versus growth is very much the debate of the hour,” Lagarde said today in remarks prepared for a speech at the University of Zurich, Switzerland. “I would argue it is not ‘either/or.’ We can design a strategy that is good for today and good for tomorrow.”

    ...While fiscal adjustment “is essential” and requires governments to lay out a plan for reducing debt in the medium run, “we know that fiscal austerity holds back growth, and the effects are worse in downturns,” Lagarde said.
    Lagarde Urges

    Lagarde's complete remarks can be found at: Anchoring Stability to Sustain Higher and Better Growth

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    Re: Krugman Wishes He Were Wrong Amid EU Austerity Backlash

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    It will be, by necessity. We tend to ignore realities until we have to pay dearly for them.
    Ignoring the reality of reduced worldwide demand is the problem with Europe. Negative GDP's will never reduce deficits.
    A healthy growing economy will grow us out of debt. IF we can keep out of more expensive wars and get rid of the tax cuts for the top bracket that is.

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