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Thread: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

  1. #311
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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Gie View Post
    Well goody for you. Have fun with that, don't forget to play something by the Divinyls as you set about your work.
    Done. Why don't you come join me and bring your little record player.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    I think you need to explain what you're trying to argue instead of asking me to make your argument for you.
    well since you want to know and cant compile your own research,you used a strawman.

    you used an out of context argument not related to the argument at hand to refute the argument at hand.



    A straw man is a component of an argument and is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position.[1] To "attack a straw man" is to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by replacing it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the "straw man"), and refuting it, without ever having actually refuted the original position
    “[The metric system is the tool of the Devil! My car gets forty rods to the hogshead, and that’s the way I likes it!” – Abe “Grampa” Simpson”

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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by beerftw View Post
    well since you want to know and cant compile your own research,you used a strawman.

    you used an out of context argument not related to the argument at hand to refute the argument at hand.



    A straw man is a component of an argument and is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position.[1] To "attack a straw man" is to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by replacing it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the "straw man"), and refuting it, without ever having actually refuted the original position
    No, the example I used was not a straw man argument. I did not falsely claim that Maggie said what she said. I was responding directly to her assertion. FAIL.

    You'd have been closer to the mark if you went with argumentum ad absurdum, but that would not be accurate either.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    No, the example I used was not a straw man argument. I did not falsely claim that Maggie said what she said. I was responding directly to her assertion. FAIL.

    You'd have been closer to the mark if you went with argumentum ad absurdum, but that would not be accurate either.
    a strawman is misrepresenting ones belief by creating a distorted view or false dillema to attemp to challenge or refute a claim or argument,when you presented the use of dna being similar to id cards,you created an out of context false argument to refute the argument at hand,rather than simply refuting that argument.
    “[The metric system is the tool of the Devil! My car gets forty rods to the hogshead, and that’s the way I likes it!” – Abe “Grampa” Simpson”

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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by beerftw View Post
    a strawman is misrepresenting ones belief by creating a distorted view or false dillema to attemp to challenge or refute a claim or argument,when you presented the use of dna being similar to id cards,you created an out of context false argument to refute the argument at hand,rather than simply refuting that argument.
    I did not misrepresent or distort Maggie's belief. In fact I quoted her belief word-for-word. If she thinks that she misspoke I'm sure she's capable of saying so.

    I wasn't saying that DNA was similar to ID cards. I was saying that, if, as Maggie said, states should do "as much as possible" to prevent fraud, then a DNA test would be the best solution.
    Last edited by AdamT; 04-20-12 at 06:54 PM.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    I did not misrepresent or distort Maggie's belief. In fact I quoted her belief word-for-word. If she thinks that she misspoke I'm sure she's capable of saying so.
    your exact words=More absurd comments. If you really believe that we're entitled to a system "that does as much as possible to prevent unathorized voting", can I assume you would support a bill that requires everyone in the country to submit a DNA sample, followed by mandatory DNA collection at the polling place? It would probably cost a couple ten billion dollars, but hey, that shouldn't be any consideration if it means eliminating 10 or 20 fraudulent votes, right?

    clearly you did create a false dillema
    “[The metric system is the tool of the Devil! My car gets forty rods to the hogshead, and that’s the way I likes it!” – Abe “Grampa” Simpson”

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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by beerftw View Post
    your exact words=More absurd comments. If you really believe that we're entitled to a system "that does as much as possible to prevent unathorized voting", can I assume you would support a bill that requires everyone in the country to submit a DNA sample, followed by mandatory DNA collection at the polling place? It would probably cost a couple ten billion dollars, but hey, that shouldn't be any consideration if it means eliminating 10 or 20 fraudulent votes, right?

    clearly you did create a false dillema
    Holy ****, I did not. You don't know what the words you are using mean.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Holy ****, I did not. You don't know what the words you are using mean.
    quite literally i think you dont know what words you are using.if you like i can go back and point out every single logical fallacy you have used,but i prefer to stick with the major one,which yet you deny,do you even know the various definitions of strawman?or are you just arguing because you believe you cant be wrong.
    “[The metric system is the tool of the Devil! My car gets forty rods to the hogshead, and that’s the way I likes it!” – Abe “Grampa” Simpson”

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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by beerftw View Post
    quite literally i think you dont know what words you are using.if you like i can go back and point out every single logical fallacy you have used,but i prefer to stick with the major one,which yet you deny,do you even know the various definitions of strawman?or are you just arguing because you believe you cant be wrong.
    I'm not arguing. I'm pointing out that responding to someone's exact premise is not a strawman argument. In fact it's sort of the definition of a non-strawman argument.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    I'm not arguing. I'm pointing out that responding to someone's exact premise is not a strawman argument. In fact it's sort of the definition of a non-strawman argument.
    you didnt respond to anyone directly,you used a false scenario to respond to a real scenario.
    “[The metric system is the tool of the Devil! My car gets forty rods to the hogshead, and that’s the way I likes it!” – Abe “Grampa” Simpson”

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