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Thread: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

  1. #221
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    giving the government the power to eliminate inequality leads to one kind of equality


    people in mass graves are all equal
    The only thing I can decipher from this cryptic bit of vague rhetoric....is that you think I am arguing for some totalitarian state, ala Pol Pot/Cambodia 1975.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Read what I wrote. Generally middle class folks spend a high percentage of their income on necessities like food, shelter, and transportation for themselves and their children. If they're smart they will also put away something for retirement. That leaves little in the way of DISPOSABLE income. If they have to pay a 23% tax, which is probably what a flat tax would entail, the tax would essentially eat up all of that disposable income (I used 80-90% as an example).

    In contrast, for someone making over a million a year, something like 95% of their income is disposable income. They end up paying a tax that amounts to about 25% on their disposable income while a middle class person ends up paying a tax that amounts to 80-100% of his disposable income. Fair?
    so what? the rich pay more than they get from government while others pay less yet they demand more

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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    The only thing I can decipher from this cryptic bit of vague rhetoric....is that you think I am arguing for some totalitarian state, ala Pol Pot/Cambodia 1975.
    I doubt many of the people who got the ball rolling there or in Stalinist Russia intended to have 40 million people die either. Its the attitude that we need to DO SOMETHING that lights the fuse

  4. #224
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    Bull****. Companies generate revenues based on sales. If you are really arguing with me over that then your not worth discussing anything with. I am not going to bother with you.
    Um...corporations' income is dealt with in CORPORATE taxation.

    We were discussing INDIVIDUAL taxation and WEALTH INEQUALITY.

    Try again.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  5. #225
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    so what? the rich pay more than they get from government while others pay less yet they demand more
    So what? They still have more disposable income than they know what to do with?
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

  6. #226
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    I doubt many of the people who got the ball rolling there or in Stalinist Russia intended to have 40 million people die either. Its the attitude that we need to DO SOMETHING that lights the fuse
    I think Pol Pot DID intend on killing a lot of people.

    Again...you are confusing "CAUSE" with "CURE". Another conservative did the same exact thing earlier.

    Try again.
    Last edited by Gimmesometruth; 04-17-12 at 06:43 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  7. #227
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    Your arguement would only slightly make sense if they middle class were currently paying nothing in taxes, which is not the case.
    In fact many in the middle class are paying no federal income tax and most of those who are a paying are paying at a far lower effective rate than they would be paying under any flat tax.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

  8. #228
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    In fact many in the middle class are paying no federal income tax and most of those who are a paying are paying at a far lower effective rate than they would be paying under any flat tax.
    Either you or Obama are lying. You decide which. A large part of his push with the Buffet rule is that the majority of middle class are paying a higher % of their income than the wealthy. The 30% number came about because that is what the majority of middle class Americans are paying. A flat tax would barely affect the middle class and would greatly affect the higher end individuals especially if you eliminate ALL the tax breaks they receive and actually take 30% from them.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
    Stephen R. Covey


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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    Either you or Obama are lying. You decide which. A large part of his push with the Buffet rule is that the majority of middle class are paying a higher % of their income than the wealthy. The 30% number came about because that is what the majority of middle class Americans are paying. A flat tax would barely affect the middle class and would greatly affect the higher end individuals especially if you eliminate ALL the tax breaks they receive and actually take 30% from them.
    The focus of the Buffet rule is on INVESTMENT INCOME, those making over $1M are getting huge breaks on their INVESTMENT INCOMES.

    The tax would affect a minority of high-income households that manage to pay relatively low rates because of deductions and preferential tax rates on investment income....

    According to administration data, the median effective tax rate for the middle 20 percent of U.S. taxpayers is 13.3 percent, including income, payroll and corporate taxes. For the top 1 percent of taxpayers, the rate is 29.6 percent, according to the 2012 Economic Report of the President. Still, 10 percent of high-income households have tax rates of 8.7 percent or less.
    Senate Blocks Buffett Rule 30% Tax Floor on Top Earners - Bloomberg


    So you are wrong on the effective rate for middle income earners, too.


    Still waiting for your proof that flat taxes decrease WEALTH INEQUALITY.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  10. #230
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    The focus of the Buffet rule is on INVESTMENT INCOME, those making over $1M are getting huge breaks on their INVESTMENT INCOMES.

    Senate Blocks Buffett Rule 30% Tax Floor on Top Earners - Bloomberg


    So you are wrong on the effective rate for middle income earners, too.


    Still waiting for your proof that flat taxes decrease WEALTH INEQUALITY.
    YOu can keep waiting. Until you learn what you are talking about and go back and read what i am talking about, like i said before, i am done discussing this with you.
    Last edited by Kreton; 04-17-12 at 07:05 PM.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
    Stephen R. Covey


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