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Thread: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

  1. #211
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    Your NYT article link i have repeatedly clicked on and it asks me to log in. I am not going to sign up for the NYT so you dont have to explain yourself. Thats not happening.

    https://myaccount.nytimes.com/auth/l...Q=Q5fQ72Q3dQ31
    You have got something going on with your browser or you have reached your 10 article limit for the month. If that is the reason, then clear your browsing history and use the direct link I provided....:
    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/17/bu...t-a-start.html




    The reason we are experiencing the wealth inequality we have now is largely because people only give their money to a few people. It has little to do with wealth disparity. Money is not being spread aroudn like it used to. The majority of Americans spend thier money with a select few businesses who cater to every need. THAT is what creates the wealth disparity we have here.
    Wow....dude, I had no idea how bad your ideas on wealth/income were. The top are not gaining their wealth from "people giving it to them", theirs comes from investment returns...which is where they have seen the greatest increases in their incomes due to tax law changes....which have been the same as a "flattening" of the tax rates. That is shown in both the NYT and Atlantic articles.

    Again and again I ask for ANY documentation of flat taxes DECREASING wealth inequality...and you just won't show it.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  2. #212
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    What is messed up, is that you think the French and Soviet Revolutions were revolts against rich folks, when in actuality, they were revolts against greedy governments.
    Wow....dude.....who was in power? They were Monarchies.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  3. #213
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    How does a flat tax result in the middle classes being taxed in the high 80's or 90's and low 20's for wealthier?
    Read what I wrote. Generally middle class folks spend a high percentage of their income on necessities like food, shelter, and transportation for themselves and their children. If they're smart they will also put away something for retirement. That leaves little in the way of DISPOSABLE income. If they have to pay a 23% tax, which is probably what a flat tax would entail, the tax would essentially eat up all of that disposable income (I used 80-90% as an example).

    In contrast, for someone making over a million a year, something like 95% of their income is disposable income. They end up paying a tax that amounts to about 25% on their disposable income while a middle class person ends up paying a tax that amounts to 80-100% of his disposable income. Fair?
    Last edited by AdamT; 04-17-12 at 06:24 PM.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

  4. #214
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    Your NYT article link i have repeatedly clicked on and it asks me to log in. I am not going to sign up for the NYT so you dont have to explain yourself. Thats not happening.

    Your link has and continues to redirect me to:

    https://myaccount.nytimes.com/auth/l...Q=Q5fQ72Q3dQ31

    Your NYT article link i have repeatedly clicked on and it asks me to log in. I am not going to sign up for the NYT so you dont have to explain yourself. Thats not happening.
    Alternate reprint of the article:
    News Headlines
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  5. #215
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    You don't understand that wealth inequality creates an unhealthy society.


    giving the government the power to eliminate inequality leads to one kind of equality


    people in mass graves are all equal

  6. #216
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Of course we need to raise taxes on the top bracket only. They are the ones that don't spend all their income. Turtledude stated that he SAVES 80% of his yearly income for a rainy day. That is hurting our consumer economy that depends on SPENDING to grow and prosper. Taking more from those that already spend all they make is self defeating since that extra tax will come directly out of their spending, lowering GDP by the same amount we tax. Given the total wage stagnation of the 95%, raising taxes on anyone but the top bracket is economic suicide. If you want more people to pay taxes you just have to give them a raise.
    I buy stocks and other investments. I don't exist to fund your desires for more government

  7. #217
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Read what I wrote. Generally middle class folks spend a high percentage of their income on necessities like food, shelter, and transportation for themselves and their children. If they're smart they will also put away something for retirement. That leaves little in the way of DISPOSABLE income. If they have to pay a 23% tax, which is probably what a flat tax would entail, the tax would essentially eat up all of that disposable income (I used 80-90% as an example).

    In contrast, for someone making over a million a year, something like 95% of their income is disposable income. They end up paying a tax that amounts to about 25% on their disposable income while a middle class person ends up paying a tax that amounts to 80-100% of his disposable income. Fair?
    Your arguement would only slightly make sense if they middle class were currently paying nothing in taxes, which is not the case.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
    Stephen R. Covey


  8. #218
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    There is lots of research on the ills of wealth inequality, just because you are not aware of it does not mean it does not exist.

    When wealth inequality gets bad enough, things go very bad, ie the French Revolution, Russian Revolution....

    feel free to revolt. I get tired of implied threats. Lets party

  9. #219
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Every version a flat tax that I've seen includes a personal exemption, which would keep many of those who currently don't pay FIT from paying under a flat tax, and of course it would result in different rates.

    If you don't have an exemption then a flat tax is simply unfair. It fails to capture the distinction between income necessary for basic survival and disposable income. In effect it results in middle class disposable income being taxed at a rate in the high 80s or 90s, versus the low 20s for wealthier individuals.

    In other words, it's sort of like taxing a corporation on gross revenue rather than net profits.
    the term fair has become meaningless though I agree there should be an exemption. But life and nature isn't fair and if you cannot pull your own weight it is just as valid to claim its unfair for others to have to pay for you as it is for you to claim its unfair to make everyone pay their own way

  10. #220
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    Re: Senate fails to advance Buffett rule

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    You have got something going on with your browser or you have reached your 10 article limit for the month. If that is the reason, then clear your browsing history and use the direct link I provided....:
    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/17/bu...t-a-start.html




    Wow....dude, I had no idea how bad your ideas on wealth/income were. The top are not gaining their wealth from "people giving it to them", theirs comes from investment returns...which is where they have seen the greatest increases in their incomes due to tax law changes....which have been the same as a "flattening" of the tax rates. That is shown in both the NYT and Atlantic articles.

    Again and again I ask for ANY documentation of flat taxes DECREASING wealth inequality...and you just won't show it.
    Bull****. Companies generate revenues based on sales. If you are really arguing with me over that then your not worth discussing anything with. I am not going to bother with you.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
    Stephen R. Covey


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