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Thread: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    You seem like a smart guy. Why are you placing yourself on the wrong side of history? Why do you put yourself on the side that leads to unnecessary poverty, misery, torture, murder and totalitarianism? Are you unfamiliar with the fruits of socialism as it has been frequently been practiced? Are you such a foe of that which is called capitalism although it just means that you get to decide for you while I decide for me?

    I do not understand why the smart ones go awry. The dullards will do as they will.
    I believe in capitalism, actually. But I believe that capitalism should serve humanity, not the other way around.

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkles View Post
    Define pure capitalism.
    This should suffice.

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    And this is where the misunderstanding arises. You see, modern, mainstream liberalism agrees with you. Most liberals favor equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome.
    Really? So y'all have changed your stripes? No more takin' from me to give to someone else as you-know-who wrote ("From each...to each...)? Really. Naw. Your just funnin' me.

    But we also understand that fostering such opportunity requires political will and that sometimes in the real world cooperation works better than competition.
    Yeah. Here is the rub. This is a bit like the use of the word "but" in a sentence. Just disregard anything that comes before it. "I ma for equal opportunity not equal outcomes but I am going to use all the instruments of governmental power to force you to give me that equal opportunity. And I get to define what that means!"

    Gotcha.

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    I believe in capitalism, actually. But I believe that capitalism should serve humanity, not the other way around.
    I think Capitalism inherently does serve humanity.

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    I believe in capitalism, actually. But I believe that capitalism should serve humanity, not the other way around.
    Hmmm. Quandary. If capitalism is a code word for me choosing what is in my best interest and you choosing what is in your best interest than how can anything else be part of that equation? Unless you mean, as I suspect that you do, that you will decide if there is just way too much free-decidin' goin' on out theah! You can fix that by taking away a portion of my ability to choose for me. You will choose on my behalf. That is what you really mean, isn't it?

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    Then I disagree with your claim.

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    And this is where the misunderstanding arises. You see, modern, mainstream liberalism agrees with you. Most liberals favor equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome. But we also understand that fostering such opportunity requires political will and that sometimes in the real world cooperation works better than competition.
    So you are more of a traditional liberal. Understood.

    The issue I have with traditional liberalism, with the goal of equal opportunity, is that you simply can't have equal opportunity. The only way to have completely equal opportunity, is to remove all opportunity.

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    And this is where the misunderstanding arises. You see, modern, mainstream liberalism agrees with you. Most liberals favor equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome. But we also understand that fostering such opportunity requires political will and that sometimes in the real world cooperation works better than competition.
    On principle, anything that takes power and choice away from the government and gives it back to the people is a good thing.

    I loathe, the idea of taxing income. That negatively rewards positive behavior with more taxes. You work harder, get paid more, and pay more taxes. In that world, why would anyone want to work harder or improve themselves? That's the fatal flaw in socialism ...it promotes and rewards mediocrity.

    Wouldn't you agree?

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    Why don't police and military count? Why is forced taxation and social planning acceptable only for areas you define but not others? You'll probably cite the constitution, but I have decades of legal precedent to stand up to any argument based on strict constructionism.
    Are you honestly saying police and military are social planning?

    On the one hand, you're proposing a mixed economy (by your definition, a community police force is certainly a socialist organization) but arguing that mixed economies are based on abuse. But that's a point that's almost not worth making, because your ideas are anathema to most Americans, so they will continue to safely exist only in your mind.
    Not this crap again. Look I saw this coming and police is not welfare nor is it part of a mixed economy. You people are predictable as hell. Please look up the term already.

    And your redirecting crap is annoying as hell to boot.
    Last edited by Henrin; 04-14-12 at 10:01 PM.

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    Re: Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    And this is where the misunderstanding arises. You see, modern, mainstream liberalism agrees with you. Most liberals favor equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome. But we also understand that fostering such opportunity requires political will and that sometimes in the real world cooperation works better than competition.
    You do realize the government only deals in forceful cooperation right? You know you just proved me right again on another point I made, yes?

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