Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma ram

Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma rampage - CBS News

This crime appears to have been very racially motivated. Glad they caught these two so quickly.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

Good on the community for stepping forward and providing the leads to get these lunatics.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

A family friend, Susan Sevenstar, told The Associated Press that England was "a good kid" and "a good, hard worker," who "was not in his right mind" after losing his father and the January suicide of his fiancee, with whom he'd recently had a baby.

"If anybody is trying to say this is a racial situation, they've got things confused," said Sevenstar, who described England as Cherokee Indian. "He didn't care what your color was. It wasn't a racist thing."

The Tulsa World reported that England's father, Carl, was shot in the chest during a scuffle with a man who had tried to break into his daughter's apartment. England later died. The man charged in the shooting is serving a six-year sentence on a weapons charge, according to Department of Corrections records."

They are all over the place trying to reframe this. I dont know...pretty much appears to be what it is. Another tragic event...certainly racially motivated. I feel for the families.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

One of the persons arrested for this had a father gunned down in cold blood by a black person. No charges filed as of 04-08-12.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

rhinefire said:

One of the persons arrested for this had a father gunned down in cold blood by a black person. No charges filed as of 04-08-12.

Click to expand...

That doesn't give him the right to gun down innocent people.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

VanceMack said:

A family friend, Susan Sevenstar, told The Associated Press that England was "a good kid" and "a good, hard worker," who "was not in his right mind" after losing his father and the January suicide of his fiancee, with whom he'd recently had a baby.

"If anybody is trying to say this is a racial situation, they've got things confused," said Sevenstar, who described England as Cherokee Indian. "He didn't care what your color was. It wasn't a racist thing."

The Tulsa World reported that England's father, Carl, was shot in the chest during a scuffle with a man who had tried to break into his daughter's apartment. England later died. The man charged in the shooting is serving a six-year sentence on a weapons charge, according to Department of Corrections records."

They are all over the place trying to reframe this. I dont know...pretty much appears to be what it is. Another tragic event...certainly racially motivated. I feel for the families.

Click to expand...

Someone who goes out to shoot a bunch of people inherently fits the description "not in his right mind."

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

muciti said:

That doesn't give him the right to gun down innocent people.

Click to expand...

Agreed.

Yet where was the public outrage and national news coverage?

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

92% of blacks murdered are killed by other blacks. Yet when the white dude kills one (or 5) it makes national headlines.

Had he been a black dude, it might have made the local news, maybe.

http://stevenbirnspeaks.wordpress.com/2012/03/28/why-its-dangerous-to-be-black-in-america/

according to theJustice Department blacks commit around 52% of the murders in this country. Around 92% of black murderers kill other black people according to the same report. Blacks are 7 times more likely to commit murder than white people and are 6 times more likely to be the victim of a murder. Want to talk about interracial murder statistics? Black on white murder is twice the rate of white on black murder. It should be noted though that interracial murders are a small percentage of murders. Only 16% of white people murdered are killed by those of another race, only 7% of blacks are killed by those of another race. Keep in mind blacks are about 13% of the population.http://stevenbirnspeaks.wordpress.com/2012/03/28/why-its-dangerous-to-be-black-in-america/

Click to expand...

I believe the two bolded areas make it very reasonable to assume any black walking around a gated community at night is up to no good. It would be IGNORANT not to say that with such a tiny percent of the population yet over half of the murders committed that keeping an extra eye on blacks is a good idea. If you don't, you are not interested in crime prevention, you're interested in PC. Blacks don't want to be targeted because of their race, they need to work on their own people and get the crime rate down.

If it were 50-50 white and black I'd say targeting blacks had a racial motive, but 52% of murders by 13% of the population is astounding. Black on white murder is twice the rate of white on black so why isn't the media reporting THIS?

And before people call me racist, I have stated nothing that was racist, I have stated things based on raw statistics. If statistically speaking drivers in Corvettes speed at a much higher percentage than drivers of minivans, would it be foolish to watch out for Vettes closely and keep an eye on them, and relax a little bit on minivan drivers? Of course both CAN speed, but statistics show one is much more likely to speed than the other. Not a great example but it shows my point.

Now this has nothing to do with the OP, so why the hell I posted it here I don't know.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

Deuce said:

Someone who goes out to shoot a bunch of people inherently fits the description "not in his right mind."

Click to expand...

"right" is a relative word. Are you implying he is 'crazy'? At first glance it sounds to me like he has been stewing on this for two years, planned the event with an accomplice and executed the event successfully. Thats not crazy. Charles Manson wasnt 'crazy'. Kim Jung Il wasnt 'not in his right mind'. Perfectly sane people do evil things all the time.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

dontworrybehappy said:

92% of blacks murdered are killed by other blacks. Yet when the white dude kills one (or 5) it makes national headlines.

Had he been a black dude, it might have made the local news, maybe.

Why It’s Dangerous To Be Black In America « Steven Birn Speaks

Click to expand...

Not white dude...Indian. And irrelevant. Anytime someone engages in a spree killing where people of ANY race are targeted it is newsworthy.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

mike2810 said:

Agreed.

Yet where was the public outrage and national news coverage?

Click to expand...

There are tens of thousands of murders in the United States every year. Are you suggesting that it's even feasible for all of them get national news coverage?

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

VanceMack said:

Not white dude...Indian. And irrelevant. Anytime someone engages in a spree killing where people of ANY race are targeted it is newsworthy.

Click to expand...

Then again.. killing sprees like this one aren't really the "territory" of blacks. It's mostly a white thing with a few exceptions. Black "murdering sprees" tend to be targeted and not just walk into a random place and start killing. The whole black shooter thing is a bit of a bear carcus in the criminology world. Same with the black serial killer. They exist, they're just rare.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

VanceMack said:

Not white dude...Indian. And irrelevant. Anytime someone engages in a spree killing where people of ANY race are targeted it is newsworthy.

Click to expand...

Really, anytime anyone engages in spree killing, period, it is newsworthy.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

VanceMack said:

Not white dude...Indian. And irrelevant. Anytime someone engages in a spree killing where people of ANY race are targeted it is newsworthy.

Click to expand...

Wait, are these people arrested not white either?

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

I don't remember the Beltway snipe being called racial killings.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

joko104 said:

I don't remember the Beltway snipe being called racial killings.

Click to expand...

Maybe it is because you're an intellectually dishonest poster or don't know he had victims who were black. Just throwing out some wild guesses before you pollute the thread with your race war diatribes.. :shrug:

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

Hatuey said:

Maybe it is because you're an intellectually dishonest poster and don't know he had victims who were black. Just a wild guess. :shrug:

Click to expand...

Ok, list those murdered who were Muslim? I think the dishonesty - as usual - is yours.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

dontworrybehappy said:

Wait, are these people arrested not white either?

Click to expand...

The alleged shooter is an Indian. (feather, not dot)

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

VanceMack said:

Charles Manson wasnt 'crazy'. Kim Jung Il wasnt 'not in his right mind'. Perfectly sane people do evil things all the time.

Click to expand...

I suggest to you that both of the above were bat **** crazy.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

joko104 said:

Ok, list those murdered who were Muslim? I think the dishonesty - as usual - is yours.

Click to expand...

Here is a Muslim:

John Allen Muhammad #1181

On September 15, 2002, there was a second shooting in Clinton, Maryland: Muhammad Rashid was locking the front door of the Three Roads Liquor Store from the outside when he heard gunshots behind him. A young man then rushed him and shot him in the stomach. Rashid testified that the young man was Malvo.

Click to expand...

Here is a black woman killed by Lee Boyd Malvo:

Local News | Prosecutors: Malvo confessed to slaying of Keenya Cook in Tacoma | Seattle Times Newspaper

During cross-examination today, prosecutor Robert F. Horan Jr. said Malvo committed his first killing at Muhammad's bidding just 10 weeks after he ran away from his mother. Malvo confessed to the Feb. 16, 2002, slaying of Keenya Cook in Tacoma, saying he walked up to her house and shot her in the face at point-blank range.

Click to expand...

:shrug: - Running away Joko?

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

muciti said:

Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma rampage - CBS News

This crime appears to have been very racially motivated. Glad they caught these two so quickly.

Click to expand...

I still believe that hate crime laws should not exist. If they are guilty hopefully they are only charged with 1st degree murder and attempted murder and are given the death penalty upon a guilty conviction.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

Top Cat said:

I suggest to you that both of the above were bat **** crazy.

Click to expand...

Its off topic, but based on what? Manson's progression to what he became is a very reasoned and logical progression. He was very much a bi-product of his childhood and teenage years. His actions were well thought out.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

VanceMack said:

Its off topic, but based on what? Manson's progression to what he became is a very reasoned and logical progression. He was very much a bi-product of his childhood and teenage years. His actions were well thought out.

Click to expand...

Being thought out doesn't mean you're not bat**** insane. Case and point: Gary Busey. The man can go on for hours. Still he's bat**** insane. Look at this face:

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

VanceMack said:

Its off topic, but based on what? Manson's progression to what he became is a very reasoned and logical progression. He was very much a bi-product of his childhood and teenage years. His actions were well thought out.

Click to expand...

I don't know if either was "crazy", but your reasoning for why you think they aren't is off. Having "well thought out actions" is not evidence of sanity.

Re: Tulsa shooting suspects Jake England, Alvin Watts charged with murder in Oklahoma

Hatuey said:

Being thought out doesn't mean you're not bat**** insane. Case and point: Gary Busey. The man can go on for hours. Still he's bat**** insane. Look at this face:

Click to expand...

Before or after the motorcycle accident and TBI?