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Thread: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by Meathead View Post
    Ok, it's a sick judgement to you. I suppose that's fair enough, but I cannot bring myself to care or take your feelings seriously enough to argue over it.
    That's fine. I'll uphold the high moral road, it's always been lonely.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue_State View Post
    I typically rate us higher than that, but I am a big homer like that.
    Whereas I'm much more a man of Principles rather than emotion.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Why do you hate America?
    Mostly because America is no longer what it was intended to be. It has lost the battle as the last great hope for humanity and shown that there is no circumstance where large groups of human beings can be expected to maintain a decent society when given the freedom to undermine that society.


    Quote Originally Posted by PrometheusBound View Post
    The serial killer of teenagers, John Wayne Gacey, spent more time alive on Death Row than the lifetimes of his victims. If we can't have speedy and cheap executions, we should return to the idea of "paying one's debt to society" by letting these people free if they participate in risky medical research, which will save more lives than the condemned themselves took.
    Nah. I'm not for the medical research concept. I want these mofo's DEAD. As in buried within 48 hours of the time their one (and only) appeal is either denied or it confirms the original finding in the case. No more 10-20 year terms sitting on death row. Nice, quick, cheap, and efficient. I believe it was former Governor Bush who was once asked what he thought of the number of executions in Texas that year, and who responded.... "It's a good start."


    Quote Originally Posted by Diogenes View Post
    Good point. As I recall, President Garfield's assassin was caught, tried, sentenced and executed within a span of 6 weeks. Back in the fifties, it was a national scandal when a convicted rapist/murderer spent 10 years on death row. And it seems like 20 years is now the norm. That doesn't seem like progress to me.
    Exactly. In fact it's the exact opposite of progress. It's mostly caused by the fact that we no longer have an expectation of lawfullness in this society, so we excuse many more criminals and have made it decidedly harder for LEO's and DA's to do their jobs.

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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I think it's quite the opposite in fact.
    Powerful weakening persuaders make you believe what they made you feel. Bend over on command.
    Last edited by PrometheusBound; 04-06-12 at 01:03 PM.
    On the outside, trickling down on the insiders.
    We won't live free until the 1% live in fear.
    Hey, richboys! Imagine the boot of democracy stomping on your faces, forever.

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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by PrometheusBound View Post
    Powerful weakening persuaders make you believe what they made you feel. Bend over on command.
    I don't even know what you're trying to say here. All I know is that human is human.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I don't even know what you're trying to say here. All I know is that human is human.
    An amazing grasp of the obvious. And yet the value we place on them are necessarily different. My son's life is far more valuable to me than any other. The lives of people who make my world a better place is more value relatively to those who make it worse, again relatively. There are, in the extreme, those whose life have no value.

    Saying that "All I know that human is human." is a simple tautology which has no practical meaning whatsoever and has no bearing on its worth.

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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by Meathead View Post
    An amazing grasp of the obvious. And yet the value we place on them are necessarily different. My son's life is far more valuable to me than any other. The lives of people who make my world a better place is more value relatively to those who make it worse, again relatively. There are, in the extreme, those whose life have no value.

    Saying that "All I know that human is human." is a simple tautology which has no practical meaning whatsoever and has no bearing on its worth.
    The values we place are for convenience and emotion. You of course would value your son’s life more than others due to the emotional attachment. Yet if it was your son or 20 other people, the rational answer is 20 other people. Your emotional sentiments are not actually part of accurate evaluation of worth. Human is human is a simple statement to equate all human life as equal; as it rationally is. Emotionally perchance not, rationally certainly true.

    To value zero is not a measurement, but rather an emotional plea. X is so bad, he’s worse than a dog. Not actually true as no human is worth less than other animals. It is also used to excuse killing. It’s a way to sidestep morality and rational thought in order to act emotionally. If we want to kill human life, due to the complexities of our intelligence and morality; under normal circumstances we become conflicted and feel guilt. The point of trying to claim a human life is worthless is to avoid that. However, if one were to be truly “human”, they would embrace it and work it out.

    Human is human. No way around it.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    The values we place are for convenience and emotion. You of course would value your son’s life more than others due to the emotional attachment. Yet if it was your son or 20 other people, the rational answer is 20 other people. Your emotional sentiments are not actually part of accurate evaluation of worth. Human is human is a simple statement to equate all human life as equal; as it rationally is. Emotionally perchance not, rationally certainly true.

    To value zero is not a measurement, but rather an emotional plea. X is so bad, he’s worse than a dog. Not actually true as no human is worth less than other animals. It is also used to excuse killing. It’s a way to sidestep morality and rational thought in order to act emotionally. If we want to kill human life, due to the complexities of our intelligence and morality; under normal circumstances we become conflicted and feel guilt. The point of trying to claim a human life is worthless is to avoid that. However, if one were to be truly “human”, they would embrace it and work it out.

    Human is human. No way around it.
    I am sorry, I am not idiotic enough to respond to something that makes little sense. I have clearly stated my case and unless you formulate a rebuttal which effectively contradicts it beyond the mathematical value of zero which is zero (another tautology), I really can't be bothered.

    Seriously, there are legions of impotent posters with whom I cannot possibly have the time to deal with.

  8. #48
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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by Meathead View Post
    I am sorry, I am not idiotic enough to respond to something that makes little sense. I have clearly stated my case and unless you formulate a rebuttal which effectively contradicts it beyond the mathematical value of zero which is zero (another tautology), I really can't be bothered.

    Seriously, there are legions of impotent posters with whom I cannot possibly have the time to deal with.
    There was nothing unclear in my response. As I said, you are going to make these labels and make your evaulation of worth based on your emotional connections and desires. If you wish to kill someone, of course you're going to claim they are worthless. They aren't actually worthless, being human in and of itself has inherent worth. Human is human. But you'd rather disregard that such that you can excuse your killing without dealing with the guilt normally associated with doing so when acted by a rational individual.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  9. #49
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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    The values we place are for convenience and emotion. You of course would value your son’s life more than others due to the emotional attachment. Yet if it was your son or 20 other people, the rational answer is 20 other people. Your emotional sentiments are not actually part of accurate evaluation of worth. Human is human is a simple statement to equate all human life as equal; as it rationally is. Emotionally perchance not, rationally certainly true.

    To value zero is not a measurement, but rather an emotional plea. X is so bad, he’s worse than a dog. Not actually true as no human is worth less than other animals. It is also used to excuse killing. It’s a way to sidestep morality and rational thought in order to act emotionally. If we want to kill human life, due to the complexities of our intelligence and morality; under normal circumstances we become conflicted and feel guilt. The point of trying to claim a human life is worthless is to avoid that. However, if one were to be truly “human”, they would embrace it and work it out.

    Human is human. No way around it.
    So instead of the death penalty, what do you want to see happen to these people? Life in jail?
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

  10. #50
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    Re: Connecticut Senate votes to abolish death penalty amid victim concerns

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue_State View Post
    So instead of the death penalty, what do you want to see happen to these people? Life in jail?
    If a crime is grave enough to warrant life in prison, then yes. The death penalty itself is archaic, costs a lot more money than housing a prisoner for life, offers little additional safety to society at large, and innately consumes innocent life (life in general as well).
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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