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Thread: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Court?

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    No spin involved -- just economics 101.
    What has the health bill got to do with economics?

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    What has the health bill got to do with economics?
    It's a tax policy thing -- you wouldn't understand.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    It's a tax policy thing -- you wouldn't understand.
    Actually no one understands it because no one has read it.

    The people who passed it never read it, the President never read it and it's unlikely the Supreme Court will read it.

    But you support it, do you?

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Actually no one understands it because no one has read it.

    The people who passed it never read it, the President never read it and it's unlikely the Supreme Court will read it.

    But you support it, do you?
    I hate to break this to you, but you could probably say the same thing about any non-trivial bill. The bills are read by staffers and the legislators are provided with summaries so they do in fact know what's in them.

    But call me crazy -- I read War and Peace, Gravity's Rainbow, and Ulysses even though they're really long. I guess I never knew that there was a direct correlation between quality and page count.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    I hate to break this to you, but you could probably say the same thing about any non-trivial bill. The bills are read by staffers and the legislators are provided with summaries so they do in fact know what's in them.

    But call me crazy -- I read War and Peace, Gravity's Rainbow, and Ulysses even though they're really long. I guess I never knew that there was a direct correlation between quality and page count.
    Right. So you don't know what's in it either.

    Have the staffers let the American public in on the deal? Or do you support it just because you trust Barack Obama, Mr. Hopeychangey, that its all gotta be good?. You think he's read it?

    Who authored it? Do you at least know that?

    And even though Nancy Pelosi said "We have to pass the bill so you can find out what is in it", you still don't know.

    But no worries. You'll support it anyway, and so will all the other Kool Aid drinkers.

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Right. So you don't know what's in it either.

    Have the staffers let the American public in on the deal? Or do you support it just because you trust Barack Obama, Mr. Hopeychangey, that its all gotta be good?. You think he's read it?

    Who authored it? Do you at least know that?

    And even though Nancy Pelosi said "We have to pass the bill so you can find out what is in it", you still don't know.

    But no worries. You'll support it anyway, and so will all the other Kool Aid drinkers.
    I've read a lot of it, and certainly several detailed summaries. See, there's nothing at all preventing the American people from learning about the bill -- except for laziness and partisan bias. Did you want Ms. Pelosi to spoon feed it to you like a little baby? Is that how you think democracy works?

    As far as who wrote it -- like all bills it was drafted by the congressional drafting service. Both houses of Congress have legislative drafting offices staffed with lawyers who are experts in their respective fields. And like all bills, you can bet that lobbyists drafted a lot of it.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    AdamT wrote:


    j-mac wrote:


    Yes, if something can be directly regulated it can be directly regulated.

    Congress has the power to create tax incentives for pretty much anything, which is what the "mandate" actually is: a tax incentive to buy insurance. It's no different than the tax incentive to buy solar panels or home mortgages or hybrid/electric cars.

    Oh, so now it is a tax....In other arguments it isn't....Look, if I don't own something, and you say that you want to regulate it, you can't regulate me unless I own it...Then you want to force me to buy it so you can regulate it? That is just not right.


    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Oh, so now it is a tax....In other arguments it isn't....Look, if I don't own something, and you say that you want to regulate it, you can't regulate me unless I own it...Then you want to force me to buy it so you can regulate it? That is just not right.


    j-mac
    He's likely not concerned with what's right, only with what's fair.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Oh, so now it is a tax....In other arguments it isn't....Look, if I don't own something, and you say that you want to regulate it, you can't regulate me unless I own it...Then you want to force me to buy it so you can regulate it? That is just not right.

    j-mac
    No, you're not getting it. You're being regulated either way.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Obama’s ‘Unprecedented’ Remarks: Is the President Running Against the Supreme Cou

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    No, you're not getting it. You're being regulated either way.
    Well, then you can not regulate me if I don't own what you are regulating.

    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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