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Taking Liberties: Arrested for reading the Bible?

Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

The title is misleading. He wasn't "reading the Bible" he was preaching, he was reading aloud as many ministers and preachers do on Sunday in church. You could have said he was reading from the Bible if you wanted a short title, that would have been closer to the truth.

Just to clarify - if someone reads Walt Whitman poems aloud instead of the bible, in this exact same place in this exact same circumstance: Are they preaching Walt Whitman?
 
The one thing I've learned from this thread:

Most people know what the 1st Amendment basically says, but not what it means and not how it's applied.
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

No he cannot.

They can't control what books maybe, that sounds draconian, but a property owner can certainly ban preaching on their property.

If not, nothing could stop somebody from standing on your front lawn and reading from the Baghavad Gita.

If you watch the whole thing and try to interpret the truth of the situation despite the editing, it looks like at one point, somebody who looked like a private security guard asked him to leave. When he didn't, that's when the cops were called. Which would also explain the cops explanation of "You can preach on your own property," if this was essentially a trespassing arrest. (We'll hope that God "Forgives him his trespasses as he forgives those who trespass against him.")
 
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Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

Just to clarify - if someone reads Walt Whitman poems aloud instead of the bible, in this exact same place in this exact same circumstance: Are they preaching Walt Whitman?

Ah, it was a literature reading....:roll:

Seriously, is there a reason other than preaching that he would be reading the Bible aloud?
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

They can't control what books maybe, that sounds draconian, but a property owner can certainly ban preaching on their property.

If not, nothing could stop somebody from standing on your front lawn and reading from the Baghavad Gita.

If you watch the whole thing and try to interpret the truth of the situation despite the editing, it looks like at one point, somebody who looked like a private security guard asked him to leave. When he didn't, that's when the cops were called. Which would also explain the cops explanation of "You can preach on your own property," if this was essentially a trespassing arrest. (We'll hope that God "Forgives him his trespasses as he forgives those who trespass against him.")

It wasn't private property. I don't understand where everyone's getting this from. Its the friggin DMV. The guy's taxes paid for the very ground he's standing on. Of course he has a right to stand there and read aloud. Your mocking of the Lord's Prayer further shows your underlying agenda in disputing this man's rights. Its not that he read, it's what he read.
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

Ah, it was a literature reading....:roll:

Seriously, is there a reason other than preaching that he would be reading the Bible aloud?
As far as I saw, he fit the second definition a lot more than the first.
preach (prch)v. preached, preach·ing, preach·es

1. To proclaim or put forth in a sermon: preached the gospel.
2. To advocate, especially to urge acceptance of or compliance with: preached tolerance and peaceful coexistence.
3. To deliver (a sermon).
v.intr.
1. To deliver a sermon.
2. To give religious or moral instruction, especially in a tedious manner

reading
Noun:
1.The action or skill of reading written or printed matter silently or aloud: "suggestions for further reading"; "reading skills".
2.Written or printed matter that can be read: "his main reading was detective stories".
 
He was reading. Good luck trying to prove he was "proselytizing" along with proving whatever a "captive audience" is.

If you read from any holy book you are proselytizing :banghead:


Free speech still applies to private property. If he was asked to leave and refused he could be arrested for tresspassing but NOT for reading from the bible. Even a parking lot which may be privatly owned is still public domain unless posted otherwise.

Simply put you are wrong. free speech its only meant to prevent the government from preventing you from speaking, not private individual

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It wasn't private property. I don't understand where everyone's getting this from. Its the friggin DMV. The guy's taxes paid for the very ground he's standing on. Of course he has a right to stand there and read aloud. Your mocking of the Lord's Prayer further shows your underlying agenda in disputing this man's rights. Its not that he read, it's what he read.

The dmv in some states is a private business contacted by the state. I have nut watched the video (as you can tell I only have a phone to come here on) but if the dmv isnt the only business in that location, it may been another business. Let's not forget that the building and parking lot are likely owned by a 3rd party
 
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Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

Just to clarify - if someone reads Walt Whitman poems aloud instead of the bible, in this exact same place in this exact same circumstance: Are they preaching Walt Whitman?

Now that post is cutting to the chase. Couldn't have been more clear.
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

Ah, it was a literature reading....:roll:

Seriously, is there a reason other than preaching that he would be reading the Bible aloud?

I believe this guy was reading the Bible aloud. Was he preaching, no. Reading and preaching are totally different.
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

It wasn't private property. I don't understand where everyone's getting this from. Its the friggin DMV.

In many cases, government office space is rented. If that is the case here, it is private property as it is owned by the landlord.
 
Now this is going to interesting to see how this plays out. "Captive audience". What exactly does that mean? Who determines exactly what a "captive audience" is and isn't? Fascinating. Here is an exerpt from the story.

"The video begins with Mark Mackey opening his Bible.

“Good morning, everyone,” he says to a crowd of 15 onlookers waiting outside the Hemet California Division of Motor Vehicles. “I would like to read a little bit of the word of God this morning.”

The video, shot in February of last year, ends with Mackey’s arrest.

“You can preach on your own property,” an officer from the California state patrol tells Mackey as he leads him away in handcuffs. “Folks, this is what the United States is coming to,” Mackey says to the crowd, who were standing outside waiting for the DMV to open. “You can talk about anything you want, but you can’t talk about the Bible.”


Read more: Taking Liberties: Arrested For Reading The Bible? | Fox News

The issue here is, was he standing on public property or was he trespassing. I think he can and will be tried for trespassing if he did what he did on someone elses property. If he was standing on his own lawn and was reading the bible I doubt he could be arrested so this who "arresting for reading the bible" is not actually the reason for arrest.

However, if it were me he would have bothered with his preaching, I would have loved to see him arrested for bothering people with religion (but that would also go for a muslim, hara krishna, scientologist or any other religous movement/cult) but if he were on public property I would have just ignored him and his annoying preachings.
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

As far as I saw, he fit the second definition a lot more than the first.
preach (prch)v. preached, preach·ing, preach·es

1. To proclaim or put forth in a sermon: preached the gospel.
2. To advocate, especially to urge acceptance of or compliance with: preached tolerance and peaceful coexistence.
3. To deliver (a sermon).
v.intr.
1. To deliver a sermon.
2. To give religious or moral instruction, especially in a tedious manner

reading
Noun:
1.The action or skill of reading written or printed matter silently or aloud: "suggestions for further reading"; "reading skills".
2.Written or printed matter that can be read: "his main reading was detective stories".

God, you people will go to any length to defend your side. Saying that he wasn't preaching is as asinine as the argument I had with someone over whether Glenn Beck's rally was political.

OK, why then was he reading the Bible?

So since reading from religious literature on someone else's private property is OK, it would be totally acceptable for me to come over to your house and start shouting verses from the Koran, right?

2. To give religious or moral instruction, especially in a tedious manner

"I wasn't preaching officer, it was a very interesting story!"
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

Ah, it was a literature reading....:roll:

Seriously, is there a reason other than preaching that he would be reading the Bible aloud?

Um, so the other people there could HEAR him.
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

Ah, it was a literature reading....:roll:

Seriously, is there a reason other than preaching that he would be reading the Bible aloud?

Who cares? The individual has right to to exercise and expression of religion.
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

Who cares? The individual has right to to exercise and expression of religion.

but he has no right to do that when trespassing.
 
Simply put you are wrong. free speech its only meant to prevent the government from preventing you from speaking, not private individual

Lets disect that statement for a second... What were they doing when they arrested him? They were preventing him from speaking. Your talking in circles. Free speech extends to all Americans Everywhere, not just on public property. The law doesnt make a distinction on the zoning, or ownership of the property in which that law is applicable.
 
Lets disect that statement for a second... What were they doing when they arrested him? They were preventing him from speaking. Your talking in circles. Free speech extends to all Americans Everywhere, not just on public property. The law doesnt make a distinction on the zoning, or ownership of the property in which that law is applicable.

Yes it does private individuals can kick you off their property for any reason. If they don't leave you can be arrested
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

but he has no right to do that when trespassing.

Even if he were trespassing, he would still have the right to say anything he wanted... He would also have the right to remain silent because anything he said can and would be used against him in a court of law etc etc etc.
 
Yes it does private individuals can kick you off their property for any reason. If they don't leave you can be arrested

Those are two seperate things. A person can be arrested for trespassing on private property, thats obvious. But unless im making threats or something like that, i cannot be arrested for what i SAY while on that property, especially when all im doing is reading from the bible. You are muddling up the two and making them the same when they are not. Also as a side note, this was NOT private property. A state run entity is public domain.
 
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Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

Even if he were trespassing, he would still have the right to say anything he wanted... He would also have the right to remain silent because anything he said can and would be used against him in a court of law etc etc etc.

But the crime was trespass, not reading the bible. I just am of the opinion that he has no right to trespass to read the bible. If he had stood on public property he could have read the bible until his voice disappeared but when you trespass you have no such rights.
 
The guy was making a nuisance of himself. My only objection to what the police did is that they didn't rough him up.
 
The guy was making a nuisance of himself. My only objection to what the police did is that they didn't rough him up.

what and risk making him an even bigger christian martyr? No thanks.
 
Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

But the crime was trespass, not reading the bible. I just am of the opinion that he has no right to trespass to read the bible. If he had stood on public property he could have read the bible until his voice disappeared but when you trespass you have no such rights.

Here is the problem. He was asked to leave a public parking lot because he was reading from the bible. Once he refused their request to leave the property, he is considered trespassing. The question is should he have been asked to leave the public parking lot for no other reason than that he was reading out loud?
 
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The guy was making a nuisance of himself. My only objection to what the police did is that they didn't rough him up.

Just like they should rough up these dumb "occupy wallstreet" idiots.
 
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Re: Man Arrested For Reading The Bible Out Loud

but he has no right to do that when trespassing.

It depends. If he were on public land, I say no harm no foul. If it was private land, then it's up to the landowner.
 
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