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Thread: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    If Massachusetts can pass a health care plan, why can't voters in the other forty nine states lobby their state representatives to follow suit?
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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Dog View Post
    If Massachusetts can pass a health care plan, why can't voters in the other forty nine states lobby their state representatives to follow suit?
    Because they are lazy and think it's the federal governments job.

    If they would have gone that route it would have saved all this debate, and they might already have it.
    "nah i think the way cons want to turn this into a political issue is funny though" - Philly Boss

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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Dog View Post
    If Massachusetts can pass a health care plan, why can't voters in the other forty nine states lobby their state representatives to follow suit?
    Quote Originally Posted by Arbo View Post
    If they would have gone that route it would have saved all this debate, and they might already have it.
    Originally it was UHC, not this whacked out, pieced together pile of junk we have now. Had we gone the UHC route there wouldn't be an issue now, either.
    Last edited by MoSurveyor; 04-06-12 at 06:19 PM.
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  4. #1014
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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Regardless, it is still tens of billions of dollars a year.
    And how much more do all the regulations and law suits cost a year? I would bet that they cost hospitals far more.

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    You're mixing apples and oranges. The mandate addresses a problem with health insurance costs. Other measures that would help those who can't afford insurance to obtain it address health care itself.

    That is simply illogical. Again -- there is more than one aspect to this thing. With respect to costs, health insurance premiums are based on probabilities. If you have a bunch of younger, healthier people who decide to shoot the dice and hope they don't sick or injured, it increases the risk level in the pool of people who do buy insurance. The higher the risk level, the higher the cost. Now, if you prevent insurance companies from rejecting folks on the basis of preexisting condition, and you have no mechanism to incent people to buy insurance, then it follows that you will have a lot of people who won't buy insurance until they actually need it. Of course that's more like theft than insurance. Imagine what would happen if you weren't required to buy auto insurance, but you could go sign up for a policy AFTER you've wrecked your car.

    So the insurers set prices based upon the risk pool, but they also have to estimate their costs. Ucompensated care also drives up costs, which in turn drives up premiums. Here's how it works: the hospital knows that it will be on the hook for X amount of ER care per year because they are not allowed to deny treatment to people who can't pay. So what does the hospital do? It increases it's prices across the board in order to make up for the cost of the uncompensated care. Insurance companies pay those inflated prices and pass the costs on to their insureds.
    Isn't the mandate suppose to lower insurance costs which would also help those that can't afford it to obtain it and healthcare? You seem to be jumping around an aweful lot here. Either the mandate is for both healthcare and insurance or it is just for insurance...which is it?

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Yes, and that's why AHCA only requires people who can afford health insurance to buy health insurance. It provides subsidies for those who can't afford it so they can afford it.
    And who determines what people can afford and not afford? The government of course. Now no doubt it would be based off of a system like foodstamps or such. You make X amount of dollars you get FS. You make Y amount of of dollars and you don't get FS. All based on your gross amount of income of course. Do you know the flaw in that? It does not take into how much is taken out due to taxes and it also does not take into account other bills that are necessities, such as a roof over your head, a car to get to work, food, clothing, car insurance, etc etc. In otherwords there are always going to be people that will fall in that grey area where they don't qualify for federal assitance but at the same time can't afford health insurance. Then what?

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Believe it or not, there are a lot of people who could afford insurance but who choose not to buy it because they'd rather drive a fancy truck or live in a fancy apartment. Again, AHCA helps those who legitimately can't afford insurance to buy insurance.
    And here we go again, class warfare. X person is living in this nice fancy apartment! We can't have that! Find ways to make them pay more!!! Forget about the fact that they may not even need insurance for years to come...make em buy it anyways!
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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    Quote Originally Posted by jambalaya View Post
    We are not talking about any country in this thread. We are talking about the U.S. Supreme Court and their decision so the inference seems apparent and wrong.
    Well now if you had kept up with the rest of the conversation that those posts respond to you would know what it was talking about and how it relates.
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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    I happen to have a great appreciation for the National Institutes of Health. Much of the research they have done and funded has contributed to the betterment of my quality of life as well as millions of others. And in turn I'm willing to bet people that have benefitted from the NIH endeavors have also contributed to your quality of life in a positive way.
    Do you think that NIH is in the health care business?

    They sound kinda researchy to me.

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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    Sure! I agree to disagree with short-sighted people all the time, so why not you, too?
    Perfect. The foolish and the short-sighted agree to disagree. What could be better?
    Last edited by Misterveritis; 04-06-12 at 07:44 PM.

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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    jabberwocky
    Why do you believe someone should have his neighbors pay for something he or she wants?

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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    I can absolutely see you trying to divert attention from the fact that Reagan signed the universal health care law.
    Reagan made a few mistakes. If he signed it and we have it why do we need this monster? Kill it before it spawns tyranny.

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    Re: Supreme Court health care arguments under way

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Dog View Post
    If Massachusetts can pass a health care plan, why can't voters in the other forty nine states lobby their state representatives to follow suit?
    Other states have tried, and failed. I have heard that California tried 3 times in in the past 10-12 years with no success. People just don't want the mandate straight up.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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