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Thread: Payrolls in U.S. Climb 227,000; Jobless Rate Holds at 8.3%

  1. #61
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    Re: Payrolls in U.S. Climb 227,000; Jobless Rate Holds at 8.3%

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    What in the world are you talking about?
    I believe he's referring to Anwar_al-Awlaki who was an American citizen who was killed by the obama administration without a trial. They recently came out and stated that "due process" does not mean "judicial process". Due process is whatever they decide it is. It set a precedent for the government killing American citizens without a trial. Another direct quote "If we can kill an American citizen in Yemen, I don't know why we couldn't do it in Iowa."

    Was he a terrorist? Almost certainly. But who is to decide these things? It's a sad day when the government can be judge, jury and executioner for it's own citizens.

    Open Channel - Can U.S. legally kill a citizen overseas without due process?
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

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    Re: Payrolls in U.S. Climb 227,000; Jobless Rate Holds at 8.3%

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    I believe he's referring to Anwar_al-Awlaki who was an American citizen who was killed by the obama administration without a trial. They recently came out and stated that "due process" does not mean "judicial process". Due process is whatever they decide it is. It set a precedent for the government killing American citizens without a trial. Another direct quote "If we can kill an American citizen in Yemen, I don't know why we couldn't do it in Iowa."

    Was he a terrorist? Almost certainly. But who is to decide these things? It's a sad day when the government can be judge, jury and executioner for it's own citizens.

    Open Channel - Can U.S. legally kill a citizen overseas without due process?
    This is one of many issues that I believe both Liberals and Conservative can come together to fight. This is a bad, very bad policy. Once the government thinks they can start killing American citizens because they deem them to be a threat, we, both Liberal and Conservatives, are in deep ****.
    I came into this world fighting, screaming and covered in someone else's blood. I have no problem going out the same way.

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    Advisor Hikertrash's Avatar
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    Re: Payrolls in U.S. Climb 227,000; Jobless Rate Holds at 8.3%

    Quote Originally Posted by a777pilot View Post
    This is one of many issues that I believe both Liberals and Conservative can come together to fight. This is a bad, very bad policy. Once the government thinks they can start killing American citizens because they deem them to be a threat, we, both Liberal and Conservatives, are in deep ****.
    I'm not agreeing.

    Anwar al-Awlaki was a known member in al Qaeda and plotted against the US. People are gunned down all the time without trial . Their only provable crime, running from the law. That's Anwar al-Awlaki

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    Re: Payrolls in U.S. Climb 227,000; Jobless Rate Holds at 8.3%

    Quote Originally Posted by a777pilot View Post
    This is one of many issues that I believe both Liberals and Conservative can come together to fight. This is a bad, very bad policy. Once the government thinks they can start killing American citizens because they deem them to be a threat, we, both Liberal and Conservatives, are in deep ****.
    I agree. I think Juan Cole has a good idea re: creating a procedure for trial in absentia to cover these sorts of cases: Al-`Awlaqi Should have been Tried in Absentia | Informed Comment
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Advisor Hikertrash's Avatar
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    Re: Payrolls in U.S. Climb 227,000; Jobless Rate Holds at 8.3%

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    I agree. I think Juan Cole has a good idea re: creating a procedure for trial in absentia to cover these sorts of cases: Al-`Awlaqi Should have been Tried in Absentia | Informed Comment
    He basically was tried in absentia, by the military.

    How's this for a weak argument?

    But the United States is not at war with Yemen, and al-`Awlaqi is not in the Yemeni military anyway. The idea that, legally speaking, the US could be at war with small terrorist organizations such as al-Qaeda strikes me as a non-starter. A rhetorical flourish such as the “war on terror” is not a legal statute or article in the constitution. The killing of al-`Awlaqi differs from that of Usamah Bin Laden because in the latter case a US expeditionary force was confronted with someone who appeared to be going for a weapon, whereas al-`Awlaqi was simply targeted.
    Of course we were at war with al Qaeda and bin Laden, of which al-Awlaqi was a member. It's not like other alQ members weren't targeted and killed by missiles.

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    Re: Payrolls in U.S. Climb 227,000; Jobless Rate Holds at 8.3%

    Quote Originally Posted by Hikertrash View Post
    He basically was tried in absentia, by the military.

    How's this for a weak argument?



    Of course we were at war with al Qaeda and bin Laden, of which al-Awlaqi was a member. It's not like other alQ members weren't targeted and killed by missiles.
    That is something that I would rather see a jury decide in a public trial than a bunch of shadowy figures in the depths of the Pentagon.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Quote Originally Posted by a777pilot View Post
    This is one of many issues that I believe both Liberals and Conservative can come together to fight. This is a bad, very bad policy. Once the government thinks they can start killing American citizens because they deem them to be a threat, we, both Liberal and Conservatives, are in deep ****.
    Too many shades of grey in that case. I do agree that it may set a dangerous precedence, but the mitigating factors don't make it as black and white some think


    Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk
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    Re: Payrolls in U.S. Climb 227,000; Jobless Rate Holds at 8.3%

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    What in the world are you talking about?
    Anwar al-Awlaki

    Anwar al-Awlaki (also spelled al-Aulaqi; Arabic: أنور العولقي‎ Anwar al-‘Awlaqī; April 21, 1971 – September 30, 2011) was an American and Yemeni imam who was an engineer and educator by training.Al-Awlaki was believed to be in hiding in Southeast Yemen in the last years of his life.[24] The U.S. deployed unmanned aircraft in Yemen to search for and kill him,[34] firing at and failing to kill him at least once,[35] before he was killed in an American drone attack in Yemen on September 30, 2011.[36] Two weeks later Al-Awlaki's 16-year-old son, Abdulrahman al-Awlaki, a U.S. citizen who was born in Denver, was also killed by a CIA-led drone strike in Yemen.[37][38][39] Nasser al-Awlaki, the father of Anwar, made an audio recording condemning the killings of his son and grandson as senseless murders.[40]

    Anwar al-Awlaki - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[
    They were assassinated with due process even though they were American citizens and entitled to protections guaranteed in the Constitution.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

  9. #69
    Educator a777pilot's Avatar
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    Re: Payrolls in U.S. Climb 227,000; Jobless Rate Holds at 8.3%

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    Too many shades of grey in that case. I do agree that it may set a dangerous precedence, but the mitigating factors don't make it as black and white some think


    Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk
    It's fairly black and white. You are either for the USA Constitution or you are not. Choose.
    I came into this world fighting, screaming and covered in someone else's blood. I have no problem going out the same way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by a777pilot View Post
    It's fairly black and white. You are either for the USA Constitution or you are not. Choose.
    If the people he joined were a nation he would be considered a detector and would lose his rights under the constitution.

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