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Thread: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to Flee

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    This seems like a covering lie. I suspect the troops are pretty pissed. When I was on active duty I looked forward to Rush. I used a reel-to-reel recorder and time to record his show. I know I would have been pissed.

    This is the best the left can muster.
    In the absence of any facts to back up your fascist perspective, your opinion lacks any credibility.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Damn, how did this topic hit 700+ posts?

    Nevermind.


    Not wishing to read that much, here's my take on the OP:

    While I expect a few more advertisers may drop his show, I expect others will rapidly replace them - and I'd be EXTREMELY shocked if his show ended because of this.


    As someone said early in the thread, "he makes too much money for too many people".
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    And she was working as a teacher at a school, not a church. So, even religious institutions run by the church (such as schools, charities, etc) have some protections despite your protestations and biases.

    The teacher that was fired for signing an abortion ad and the other teacher that was fired because he was planning a gay wedding - also at schools, not churches. The protections, quite obviously go beyond just churches.
    But they separated her from the others because she was part of the ministry. If you read what I linked, they made a specific point to note her seminary training and that she was a minister, not a contracted teachers. The had too have made this point for a reason. They had every opportunity to clearly say what you think they said. but they didn't. They said she was ministerial, and as such could be treated as clergy. this difference is important to the debate.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    But they separated her from the others because she was part of the ministry. If you read what I linked, they made a specific point to note her seminary training and that she was a minister, not a contracted teachers. The had too have made this point for a reason. They had every opportunity to clearly say what you think they said. but they didn't. They said she was ministerial, and as such could be treated as clergy. this difference is important to the debate.
    I indicated a reason they probably made that distinction, you want to attribute a different reason - both are guesses. The court did not rule on wether the exception would apply to non-ministirial employees. They also did not indicate who would qualify for a ministirial exception - with concurrences taking a broader view of who would qualify. Your guess isn't anymore valid, reasoned or logical then mine, although I realize you want to believe it is. It's just a guess based on your own biases.

    Regardless of all that though, the religious institution in this case clearly has 1st ammendment protections. You can not reasonably argue that they don't. You can argue that their protections are possibly limited, but they still have them in some circumstances.

    Did Obama's BC mandate take this into account or are these schools going to be required to provide insurance covering BC against their beliefs to even their employees that qualify for a ministirial exception?

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    I indicated a reason they probably made that distinction, you want to attribute a different reason - both are guesses. The court did not rule on wether the exception would apply to non-ministirial employees. They also did not indicate who would qualify for a ministirial exception - with concurrences taking a broader view of who would qualify. Your guess isn't anymore valid, reasoned or logical then mine, although I realize you want to believe it is. It's just a guess based on your own biases.

    Regardless of all that though, the religious institution in this case clearly has 1st ammendment protections. You can not reasonably argue that they don't. You can argue that their protections are possibly limited, but they still have them in some circumstances.

    Did Obama's BC mandate take this into account or are these schools going to be required to provide insurance covering BC against their beliefs to even their employees that qualify for a ministirial exception?
    Clearly churches and ministry do, but that is all that is clear. Otherwise, as I have already agreed, the question is open. But, if it was meant to say that schools, hospitals, contracted teachers, doctors and nurses and janitoral staff were covered, they had the opportunity to make that clear. They didn't. This should give you some pause.

    These are not churches, and the people over all are not clergy.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Clearly churches and ministry do, but that is all that is clear. Otherwise, as I have already agreed, the question is open. But, if it was meant to say that schools, hospitals, contracted teachers, doctors and nurses and janitoral staff were covered, they had the opportunity to make that clear. They didn't. This should give you some pause.
    When even a liberal, Obama apointed judge is trying to broaden the definition and saying it should be left up to the religious organization, that should really give you some pause.

    These are not churches, and the people over all are not clergy.
    You seem confused. This wasn't a church. This was a lutheran elementary school - think catholic school for a different denomination. So, religious organization have, at the very least some, first ammendment protections. It is not only churches as you were previously arguing.

    From just one of thousands of articles:

    The case started at a Lutheran elementary school in Michigan where a teacher
    The mandate did not make this exception, did it?

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    When even a liberal, Obama apointed judge is trying to broaden the definition and saying it should be left up to the religious organization, that should really give you some pause.
    Not exactly what was said. agian, as pointed out, they spent a lot of time determining that she was clergy.

    You seem confused. This wasn't a church. This was a lutheran elementary school - think catholic school for a different denomination. So, religious organization have, at the very least some, first ammendment protections. It is not only churches as you were previously arguing.
    I'm not confused at all. But she was deemed ministerial and not contract teacher. Like I keep pointing out, they spent a lot of time making that distinction, when all they had to do, if you were right, is merely say it was up to the church regardless of her status. They did not do that.

    From just one of thousands of articles:



    The mandate did not make this exception, did it?
    Continue reading. The point they made was that she was ministerial.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Not exactly what was said. agian, as pointed out, they spent a lot of time determining that she was clergy.



    I'm not confused at all. But she was deemed ministerial and not contract teacher.
    At a school, not at a church. The court clearly found that the religious school has first ammendment rights, as of now only in some cases.

    Obama's mandate is requiring that all religious institutions (this includes religious schools) provide BC coverage to all of their employees - "all of their employees" includes teachers defined as ministirial employees. This is in violation of the religious institutions rights - as found by this judgement.

    Non-minisitiral employees could very well also be included. No ruling was made related to non-ministerial employees - so anything you say in regards to them is just your own guess based on your own bias.

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    At a school, not at a church. The court clearly found that the religious school has first ammendment rights, as of now only in some cases.

    Obama's mandate is requiring that all religious institutions (this includes religious schools) provide BC coverage to all of their employees - "all of their employees" includes teachers defined as ministirial employees. This is in violation of the religious institutions rights - as found by this judgement.

    Non-minisitiral employees could very well also be included. No ruling was made related to non-ministerial employees - so anything you say in regards to them is just your own guess based on your own bias.
    No. They found that ministerial staff at a school have that right. That is all they ruled on. And according to this ruling, it would not cover ministerial personal, which frankly were always exempt. Until they rule on non-ministerial staff, you cannot conclude that all school and hospital personal are covered under the ruling. It would be premature.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: 'Rush Limbaugh Show' Broadcasts Five Minutes of Dead Air as Sponsors Continue to

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No. They found that ministerial staff at a school have that right. That is all they ruled on. And according to this ruling, it would not cover ministerial personal, which frankly were always exempt. Until they rule on non-ministerial staff, you cannot conclude that all school and hospital personal are covered under the ruling. It would be premature.
    I think you are so clouded by your biases, that you insist on continuing to argue something that I am not. did Obama's BC mandate allow an exception for ministerial staff at religious organizations, such as schools? If not, then the mandate is obviously violating first ammendment rights of religious organizations that employ ministerial staff.

    Wether non-ministerial staff also qualify for the exception has not yet been determined. Many lower courts (and appeals courts) have ruled that they do. Until one of those cases, make it to the SC, all you can do is guess.

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