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Thread: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    We all need oil and gas prices to reflect the true cost of using that fuel. Right now, your oil consumption is being artificially subsidized by your grandchildren's generation.
    And, this alternate energy and environmental policies are not?

    Back off the restrictive policies, remove the obstacles to fossil fuels. Tax all forms of energy the same. Stop funding research that the private sector should do on its own, stop providing direct gifts to those purchasing one product over the other, and let the chips fall where they may.

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Which is why we should produce MORE. Actually, we should produce more because it would create jobs, wealth, and energy. And its the right of the citizens who own the resources to use them as they see fit. I have yet to see you explain why not.
    Do you have some magic oil beans that you wish to try? The fact is we have used up most of the cheap oil in the US. That is why we fight middle east wars to keep their oil flowing to the world market.

    There has not been a single year since 1971 that we have produced as much oil as we consume, regardless of which party was in control of the government.

    As Cheney and the Energy Task Force put it in their report, STRATEGIC ENERGY POLICY CHALLENGES FOR THE 21ST CENTURY when they recommended invasion of Iraq:

    "Dependence is so incredibly large, and growing so inexorably, that national autonomy is simply
    not a viable goal. In the global economy, it may not even be a desirable one."
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Do you have some magic oil beans that you wish to try? The fact is we have used up most of the cheap oil in the US. That is why we fight middle east wars to keep their oil flowing to the world market.

    There has not been a single year since 1971 that we have produced as much oil as we consume, regardless of which party was in control of the government.

    As Cheney and the Energy Task Force put it in their report, STRATEGIC ENERGY POLICY CHALLENGES FOR THE 21ST CENTURY when they recommended invasion of Iraq:

    "Dependence is so incredibly large, and growing so inexorably, that national autonomy is simply
    not a viable goal. In the global economy, it may not even be a desirable one."
    LOL, fracture based mining....heard of it?

    The Bakka formation is about to pass Alaska in oil capacity. Magic beans indeed.

    Fuel Fix North Dakota oil production
    ND is producing 450k barrels a day and there are similar formation all over the midwest with mixes of natural gas, about 1/5th if I read right.

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    The government should be using its money to encourage alternative energy spending. Considering some of the wasted money out there now, i dont see any reason why it isnt a perfectly reasonable idea. Oil is far more destructive to the environment than the alternatives.
    One, its unconstitutional, two its unaffordable, three, its inefficient to mess with the free market. If you want alternative energy, it should earn its own way, the same as oil overcame coal, electricity overcame manual power.

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    We all need oil and gas prices to reflect the true cost of using that fuel. Right now, your oil consumption is being artificially subsidized by your grandchildren's generation.
    For example?

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Do you have some magic oil beans that you wish to try? The fact is we have used up most of the cheap oil in the US. That is why we fight middle east wars to keep their oil flowing to the world market.

    There has not been a single year since 1971 that we have produced as much oil as we consume, regardless of which party was in control of the government.

    As Cheney and the Energy Task Force put it in their report, STRATEGIC ENERGY POLICY CHALLENGES FOR THE 21ST CENTURY when they recommended invasion of Iraq:

    "Dependence is so incredibly large, and growing so inexorably, that national autonomy is simply
    not a viable goal. In the global economy, it may not even be a desirable one."
    Another argument for more oil. What evidence do you have that most the cheap oil in the US has been used? So what if it has? What does that have to do with preventing people from trying?

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by OpportunityCost View Post
    LOL, fracture based mining....heard of it?

    The Bakka formation is about to pass Alaska in oil capacity. Magic beans indeed.

    Fuel Fix North Dakota oil production
    ND is producing 450k barrels a day and there are similar formation all over the midwest with mixes of natural gas, about 1/5th if I read right.

    Yeah, I've heard of it, and know that is not cost competitive with cheap middle east oil, which why we still import more than half our oil.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Another argument for more oil. What evidence do you have that most the cheap oil in the US has been used?

    The fact there has not been a single year since 1971 that we could produce as much oil as we consume regardless of the party in control of government.


    So what if it has? What does that have to do with preventing people from trying?
    Knock yourself out, it the meantime we need to develop alternatives.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    Now is not the time to be putting out that kind of money. We don't have the vehicles to utilize this infrastructure. We should wait till they arrive and are affordable to the masses, which won't be for a long time.

    In the meantime, Obama should be concentrating on the effects of high gas prices on our citizens right now. I don't think he will, though.
    A billion dollars or more wasted on Solyndra, Ener1, SpectraWatt, Evergreen, Axiom and Beacon.

    My signature line tell why Obama won't.



    In this week's address, Chairman of the Natural Resources Committee Doc Hastings (R-WA) discusses how the president is unwilling to work toward energy independence in our nation. Gas prices are on the rise again, and our current administration has given no impression that they're serious about lowering our energy costs and creating much-needed jobs. House Republicans are working to open domestic energy production and ease the burden on small businesses so they can grow and hire again. It's all part of our plan at GOP.gov - The Website of the Republican Majority in Congress
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    The increase in gas prices involves supply and demand issues coming to a head at a planetary level.

    In April, 2010 the US Military warned that:

    "as early as 2015, the shortfall in output could reach nearly 10 million barrels per day," says the report, which has a foreword by a senior commander, General James N Mattis."

    US military warns oil output may dip causing massive shortages by 2015 | Business | The Guardian

    Here's a good summary of the situation.

    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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