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Thread: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Hypotheticals and rhetoric are pointless.

    Back up your claim if you can and show us the 100x demand sources of cheap oil???
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    It's obvious in the sense of probability and statistics. Oil drilling causes large and small environmental problems. Drastically increasing the amount of drilling will have a concomitant effect on the number of environmental problems.
    It obvious that we have benefited exponentially more from the use of oil than any environmental effects its had. Trillions upon trillions in wealth created, hundreds of thousands of jobs. Innovation, quality of life, tens of thousands of petroleum based products, trillions of miles of travel. Damn near everything we use is in some way connected to oil.

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    It obvious that we have benefited exponentially more from the use of oil than any environmental effects its had. Trillions upon trillions in wealth created, hundreds of thousands of jobs. Innovation, quality of life, tens of thousands of petroleum based products, trillions of miles of travel. Damn near everything we use is in some way connected to oil.
    You have already made it clear you have no concern for environmental and health damage that future generations will have to deal with, as long as your prices can be kept down now for yourself, so who gives a **** what you think?
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Back up your claim if you can and show us the 100x demand sources of cheap oil???
    Easy.

    http://www.eia.gov/international/reserves.html

    1400 billion barrels of oil proven as of 2009. The world consumed 90 billion barrels in 2009. So thats 10x right there. Only the US has another 1.4 trillion of technically recoverable oil, and the rest of the world keeps finding more oil every year, so up we go.

    http://energyforamerica.org/wp-conte...ntoryFINAL.pdf

    Providence surges on Irish oil discovery - FT.com
    Oil discovered 24 km from Tel Aviv coastline - JPost - Headlines
    Oil belt found in South China Sea|Economy|chinadaily.com.cn

    I can go on.

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    You have already made it clear you have no concern for environmental and health damage that future generations will have to deal with, as long as your prices can be kept down now for yourself, so who gives a **** what you think?
    You keep responding, so I guess you do.

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    You have already made it clear you have no concern for environmental and health damage that future generations will have to deal with, as long as your prices can be kept down now for yourself, so who gives a **** what you think?
    This is what is boils down to right here. Future generations ability to use oil + earth < you wanting slightly cheaper gas. Greed at its finest.

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Easy.

    http://www.eia.gov/international/reserves.html

    1400 billion barrels of oil proven as of 2009. The world consumed 90 billion barrels in 2009. So thats 10x right there. Only the US has another 1.4 trillion of technically recoverable oil, and the rest of the world keeps finding more oil every year, so up we go.

    http://energyforamerica.org/wp-conte...ntoryFINAL.pdf

    Providence surges on Irish oil discovery - FT.com
    Oil discovered 24 km from Tel Aviv coastline - JPost - Headlines
    Oil belt found in South China Sea|Economy|chinadaily.com.cn

    I can go on.
    Go on all you want, you still haven't proven your claim of 100x demand of cheap oil. Recoverable oil, does not mean affordable oil, which is why prices have continued go up over the last two decades, and why the US military warned that we could see shortages of cheap oil as soon as 2015, with serious economic consequences!
    Last edited by Catawba; 03-15-12 at 05:31 PM.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    This is what is boils down to right here. Future generations ability to use oil + earth < you wanting slightly cheaper gas. Greed at its finest.
    But, if you and Catawba are claiming that the future of energy is not oil, then it would follow that there is no need to conserve the reserves for the future.

    In the meantime, you do realize that the debt being left for those future generations is currently over $50K each and climbing.

    At present, no alternate energy is economically viable and therefore must be subsidized. Leaving still more debt for those future generations you care so much about.

    For me, a sound energy policy would embrace both the needs of the now and future. So, I guess my position would be oil and nuclear for the now, and sensible research for the future. Not raise the price of fossil and nuclear by limiting supply in order to increase the price to make alternate more competitive.

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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    This is what is boils down to right here. Future generations ability to use oil + earth < you wanting slightly cheaper gas. Greed at its finest.

    With all due respect, it isn't about greed, or I should say not just about greed. Do we all want cheeper stuff? Yes, I'd say we do, we are constantly looking for ways to save the money we earn for ourselves. Is that greed?

    Second, what about those that are living on lifes razors edge? Paycheck, to paycheck that make the decisions every day between food, heat, gas, and or, other necessary life costs? We don't have different levels of gas price....Every penny Obama takes out of the economy in order to 'nudge' us into green energy that is yet unsustainable, and unproven, is another penny taken out of the economy forever. It kills jobs, it kills savings, it kills standard of living in this country....But pfft, who cares about that, its all just greed right?


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    Re: Barack Obama pushes for $1bn green tax credits

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    With all due respect, it isn't about greed, or I should say not just about greed. Do we all want cheeper stuff? Yes, I'd say we do, we are constantly looking for ways to save the money we earn for ourselves. Is that greed?

    Second, what about those that are living on lifes razors edge? Paycheck, to paycheck that make the decisions every day between food, heat, gas, and or, other necessary life costs? We don't have different levels of gas price....Every penny Obama takes out of the economy in order to 'nudge' us into green energy that is yet unsustainable, and unproven, is another penny taken out of the economy forever. It kills jobs, it kills savings, it kills standard of living in this country....But pfft, who cares about that, its all just greed right?


    j-mac
    Second, what about those that are living on lifes razors edge? Paycheck, to paycheck that make the decisions every day between food, heat, gas, and or, other necessary life costs?
    If they cant afford gas, they can get on a bus. Or walk. Or ride a bike. I dont care. Saying people are living paycheck to paycheck is no reason to destroy the Earth. There is no direct line there.

    We don't have different levels of gas price
    I am not sure the point of this part of your statement. But every gas station I have ever been to has had 3 different choices for gas at different prices.

    Every penny Obama takes out of the economy in order to 'nudge' us into green energy that is yet unsustainable, and unproven, is another penny taken out of the economy forever.
    So you dont think the technology is worth investing in? Green energy is never going to be sustainable or proven unless you invest in it.
    It kills jobs, it kills savings, it kills standard of living in this country
    Be clear. What is killing jobs?

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