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Thread: Another School Shooting

  1. #141
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    Re: Another School Shooting

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    In every other case, some form of SSRI type drug was being prescribed to the offender (except where military records were not made available.)

    The comparison would be something between crystal meth and speed in terms of how it affects your brain.

    Though, I'm not anything of an expert I got 25 cents that says he was on some sort of Ritalin or Prozac type of drug.

    Prior to the debut of Prozac in 1987 (the first SSRI) what caused mutli-victim shootings? I'm not saying this kid wasn't on anything, but you must have missed the point earlier that young folk have been committing mutli-victim shootings for as long as guns have been around. In the United States you can probably go back further if you have the right records but July 26, 1764 seems to be the outside limit on the internet.

    (Pontiac's Rebellion school massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Uh-oh, better not count that one it had to do with the French and Indian War.) It just offends me when people assume "drugs" legal or not "make" people do something, it can influence yes.

    Note the 2000's have seen a decline in school shootings since Columbine, and as pharmaceuticals have become more available.

    Also according to wikipedia:
    1992–1993 (44 Homicides and 55 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1993–1994 (42 Homicides and 51 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1994–1995 (17 Homicides and 20 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1995–1996 (29 Homicides and 35 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1996–1997 (23 Homicides and 25 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1997–1998 (35 Homicides and 40 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1998–1999 (25 Homicides from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1999–2000 (25 Homicides from school shootings in the U.S.)

    2000–2001 (19 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2001–2002 (4 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2002–2003 (14 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2003–2004 (29 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2004–2005 (20 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2005–2006 (5 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2006–2007 (38 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2007–2008 (3 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2008–2009 (10 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2009–2010 (5 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)

    Something I found that explains why kids can't even write an essay anymore.

    Interesting: Checklist of Characteristics of Youth Who Have Caused School-Associated Violent Deaths
    Checklist of Characteristics of Youth Who Have Caused School-Associated Violent Deaths - National School Safety Center
    "The National School Safety Center, blah, blah, blah... While there is no foolproof system for identifying potentially dangerous students who may harm themselves and/or others, this checklist provides a starting point.

    These characteristics should serve to alert school administrators, teachers and support staff to address needs of troubled students through meetings with parents, provision of school counseling, guidance and mentoring services, as well as referrals to appropriate community health/social services and law enforcement personnel. Further, such behavior should also provide an early warning signal that safe school plans and crisis prevention/intervention procedures must be in place to protect the health and safety of all school students and staff members so that schools remain safe havens for learning."

    _______ Has a history of tantrums and uncontrollable angry outbursts.
    _______ Characteristically resorts to name calling, cursing or abusive language.
    _______ Habitually makes violent threats when angry.
    _______ Has previously brought a weapon to school.
    _______ Has a background of serious disciplinary problems at school and in the community.
    _______ Has a background of drug, alcohol or other substance abuse or dependency.
    _______ Is on the fringe of his/her peer group with few or no close friends.
    _______ Is preoccupied with weapons, explosives or other incendiary devices.
    _______ Has previously been truant, suspended or expelled from school.
    _______ Displays cruelty to animals.
    _______ Has little or no supervision and support from parents or a caring adult.
    _______ Has witnessed or been a victim of abuse or neglect in the home.
    _______ Has been bullied and/or bullies or intimidates peers or younger children.
    _______ Tends to blame others for difficulties and problems s/he causes her/himself.
    _______ Consistently prefers TV shows, movies or music expressing violent themes and acts.
    _______ Prefers reading materials dealing with violent themes, rituals and abuse.
    _______ Reflects anger, frustration and the dark side of life in school essays or writing projects.
    _______ Is involved with a gang or an antisocial group on the fringe of peer acceptance.
    _______ Is often depressed and/or has significant mood swings.
    _______ Has threatened or attempted suicide.

    While some of these are very serious, how many of these has the average teenager not expressed / dealt with at some point? Writing essays on the "dark side of life", truancy, little or no supervision, been bullied or has bullied (which one is it?), prefers TV shows, movies or music expressing violent themes and acts, is often depressed and/or has significant mood swings (aren't significant mood swings what make teens so precious?) this stuff describes lots and lots and lots of people I know.

    I can't imagine why school administrators are confused. I am not insensitive to the situation, just incensed that there are so many fallacy's, if we want to stop school shootings try being nice to the kids.

    Last edited by taxigirl; 02-29-12 at 03:04 AM.

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  2. #142
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    Re: Another School Shooting

    Quote Originally Posted by RDS View Post
    At least I am not alone here.

    Why America Needs to Ban Handguns



    VPC - Unsafe in Any Hands: Why America Needs to Ban Handguns
    Well, that settles it. An anti-gun think tank writes a biased piece based on actions they want. You've totally changed my mind, you're right I am now for scrapping 200+ years of liberty and freedom because of an outsider opinion and an anti-gun article.

    Seriously though, this is now filed in the "We don't give a ****" catagory.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Quote Originally Posted by taxigirl View Post
    Prior to the debut of Prozac in 1987 (the first SSRI) what caused mutli-victim shootings? I'm not saying this kid wasn't on anything, but you must have missed the point earlier that young folk have been committing mutli-victim shootings for as long as guns have been around. In the United States you can probably go back further if you have the right records but July 26, 1764 seems to be the outside limit on the internet.

    (Pontiac's Rebellion school massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Uh-oh, better not count that one it had to do with the French and Indian War.) It just offends me when people assume "drugs" legal or not "make" people do something, it can influence yes.

    Note the 2000's have seen a decline in school shootings since Columbine, and as pharmaceuticals have become more available.

    Also according to wikipedia:
    1992–1993 (44 Homicides and 55 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1993–1994 (42 Homicides and 51 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1994–1995 (17 Homicides and 20 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1995–1996 (29 Homicides and 35 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1996–1997 (23 Homicides and 25 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1997–1998 (35 Homicides and 40 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1998–1999 (25 Homicides from school shootings in the U.S.)
    1999–2000 (25 Homicides from school shootings in the U.S.)

    2000–2001 (19 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2001–2002 (4 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2002–2003 (14 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2003–2004 (29 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2004–2005 (20 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2005–2006 (5 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2006–2007 (38 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2007–2008 (3 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2008–2009 (10 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)
    2009–2010 (5 Deaths resulting from school shootings in the U.S.)

    Something I found that explains why kids can't even write an essay anymore.

    Interesting: Checklist of Characteristics of Youth Who Have Caused School-Associated Violent Deaths
    Checklist of Characteristics of Youth Who Have Caused School-Associated Violent Deaths - National School Safety Center
    "The National School Safety Center, blah, blah, blah... While there is no foolproof system for identifying potentially dangerous students who may harm themselves and/or others, this checklist provides a starting point.

    These characteristics should serve to alert school administrators, teachers and support staff to address needs of troubled students through meetings with parents, provision of school counseling, guidance and mentoring services, as well as referrals to appropriate community health/social services and law enforcement personnel. Further, such behavior should also provide an early warning signal that safe school plans and crisis prevention/intervention procedures must be in place to protect the health and safety of all school students and staff members so that schools remain safe havens for learning."

    _______ Has a history of tantrums and uncontrollable angry outbursts.
    _______ Characteristically resorts to name calling, cursing or abusive language.
    _______ Habitually makes violent threats when angry.
    _______ Has previously brought a weapon to school.
    _______ Has a background of serious disciplinary problems at school and in the community.
    _______ Has a background of drug, alcohol or other substance abuse or dependency.
    _______ Is on the fringe of his/her peer group with few or no close friends.
    _______ Is preoccupied with weapons, explosives or other incendiary devices.
    _______ Has previously been truant, suspended or expelled from school.
    _______ Displays cruelty to animals.
    _______ Has little or no supervision and support from parents or a caring adult.
    _______ Has witnessed or been a victim of abuse or neglect in the home.
    _______ Has been bullied and/or bullies or intimidates peers or younger children.
    _______ Tends to blame others for difficulties and problems s/he causes her/himself.
    _______ Consistently prefers TV shows, movies or music expressing violent themes and acts.
    _______ Prefers reading materials dealing with violent themes, rituals and abuse.
    _______ Reflects anger, frustration and the dark side of life in school essays or writing projects.
    _______ Is involved with a gang or an antisocial group on the fringe of peer acceptance.
    _______ Is often depressed and/or has significant mood swings.
    _______ Has threatened or attempted suicide.

    While some of these are very serious, how many of these has the average teenager not expressed / dealt with at some point? Writing essays on the "dark side of life", truancy, little or no supervision, been bullied or has bullied (which one is it?), prefers TV shows, movies or music expressing violent themes and acts, is often depressed and/or has significant mood swings (aren't significant mood swings what make teens so precious?) this stuff describes lots and lots and lots of people I know.

    I can't imagine why school administrators are confused. I am not insensitive to the situation, just incensed that there are so many fallacy's, if we want to stop school shootings try being nice to the kids.

    Let me clarify; I wasn't saying these drugs are CAUSING a person to go crazy and start shooting people at random... More that it's undoubtedly a mitigating factor that would take someone that THINKS about doing this and removes the barrier that would prevent a person from actually acting out on those thoughts.

    I'm pretty sure that even the drug inserts on these drugs discuss psychotic efforts and suicide as "side effects".

    I don't have the numbers, but I'd be interested in seeing the numbers to compare pre-SSRI drugs to after.

  4. #144
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    Re: Another School Shooting

    Quote Originally Posted by taxigirl View Post
    You should wait and see what happens when us broads don't get a chance to get that aggression out.
    Yeah, we used to call them cat fights.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
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  5. #145
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    Re: Another School Shooting

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    In every other case, some form of SSRI type drug was being prescribed to the offender (except where military records were not made available.)The comparison would be something between crystal meth and speed in terms of how it affects your brain.Though, I'm not anything of an expert I got 25 cents that says he was on some sort of Ritalin or Prozac type of drug.
    He may have been, but my wager is on the fact that he came from screwed-up parents and had a screwed-up life. Any form of excess in child-rearing will contribute to raising a maladaptive child. If you are violent and beat them, they will be screwed up. If you coddle and baby them, they will be screwed up. Alot of people can't take the middle road and do what's best for the child, which is to disclipine them with love, doing what the child needs in order to be a healthy functioning member of society.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
    -C G Jung

  6. #146
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    Re: Another School Shooting

    Quote Originally Posted by SLAMRAAM View Post
    We need less gun control in schools - it should be legal for every kid to take a gun to school - if we did this, then the random nutcases like this guy would think twice about pulling a gun on someone -



    Saddly he was right because if we listened to Archie, 911 could have been avoided.
    Last edited by Sparky; 02-29-12 at 01:01 PM.

  7. #147
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    A armed society is polite society.

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  8. #148
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    Re: Another School Shooting

    Quote Originally Posted by RDS View Post
    At least I am not alone here.

    Why America Needs to Ban Handguns



    VPC - Unsafe in Any Hands: Why America Needs to Ban Handguns
    VPC is not exactly known for fair, unbiased analysis of facts. The majority of that article, if not attempting to outright lie, is at the very least riddled with inaccuracy and naivete.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

  9. #149
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    Re: Another School Shooting

    Quote Originally Posted by RDS View Post
    At least I am not alone here.

    Why America Needs to Ban Handguns



    VPC - Unsafe in Any Hands: Why America Needs to Ban Handguns


    You're more alone than you think.


    October 26, 2011
    Record-Low 26% in U.S. Favor Handgun Ban
    Support for stricter gun laws in general is lowest Gallup has measured
    Record-Low 26% in U.S. Favor Handgun Ban


    Even if it were a majority, in the US Constitution it takes a 2/3rds majority of states to change the Constitution, which is what it would take to properly enact a handgun ban.

    So solly, not happening any time this century.

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    Re: Another School Shooting

    Quote Originally Posted by cpgrad08 View Post
    A armed society is polite society...
    what a strange and stupid thing to say.

    oh, maybe you mean if everyone is carrying guns, folks are more likely to be polite, due to the sense of fear & intimidation of a gunfight?

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