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Thread: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

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    Re: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

    Quote Originally Posted by EagleAye View Post
    You know folks, with all the debates going on about the price of oil/gas, I'm seeing a lot of mixed messages. Can anyone provide just the straight poop on how oil and gas is priced?

    It seems that the prime movers are Supply and Demand, and Speculators, right? So if the US produces more domestic oil, that domestic oil will not necessarily be cheaper because oil price follows the Intl market price, right? But sometimes some countries get oil for more or less, and that seems contradictory, yes? And how can the president be or not be responsible for the price of gas?

    And then the price of gas is obviously influenced by the price of oil, but does that (gas) follow Intl pricing? I don't think it does. The price of gas follows the regular rules of Supply and Demand I would think because I can get different gas prices from different stations in the same town. Correct?

    I'm not trying to be a wiseass, I'm asking sincerely.
    No domestic oil is not cheaper and supply has little to do with price. 60% of oil produced is "owned" by entities that use no oil, mostly hedge funds and commercial banks. Those funds are now attacking oil prices with the "Iran Situation" being the excuse. In the commodities market, the more money chasing oil futures the higher the price gets. It is nothing less than a perversion of the system of supply and demand that needs to be regulated out of existance. The only ones who should be buying oil are those that use it. Until that happens we are at the mercy of the speculators and their enormous wallets.

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    Re: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

    Another factor driving gasoline prices higher: U.S. refineries continue to set new records for exports of refined fuels because they can make more money selling products like diesel overseas.

    During the week of Feb. 10, refineries exported a record average of 3.1 million barrels of refined fuels a day. That's up 42.6% compared with the same week in 2011 and up 80.6% since 2010.
    L.A. on brink of $4-a-gallon gasoline ahead of holiday weekend - latimes.com

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    Re: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    No domestic oil is not cheaper and supply has little to do with price. 60% of oil produced is "owned" by entities that use no oil, mostly hedge funds and commercial banks. Those funds are now attacking oil prices with the "Iran Situation" being the excuse. In the commodities market, the more money chasing oil futures the higher the price gets. It is nothing less than a perversion of the system of supply and demand that needs to be regulated out of existance. The only ones who should be buying oil are those that use it. Until that happens we are at the mercy of the speculators and their enormous wallets.
    Exactly, and it is not only oil. Even food stuffs are being hoarded like this, jacking up world prices on many essential food stuffs. The 150 dollar oil price a few years back was because of this very speculation.
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    Re: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

    Quote Originally Posted by sharon View Post
    Its fear driven.

    If Iran is bombed the ppb may climb to $180 in a matter of hours.
    That's utter bull****. Fear driven when there is nothing going on? It is an excuse, just as Libya was an excuse to keep oil prices up. When major banks have oil tankers sitting around full of oil, just waiting for the oil to go up, then you know that the market under someone's influence.

    When 64% of oil sold in a month went to speculators then you know that the system is broken. When oil went up during the first and second oil crisis, speculators accounted for a minor part of the trade.. that was fear.. that was based on facts.. Today speculators control the prices of oil (and other commodities and bond yields) as they see fit.

    Tell me why oil is now HIGHER than it was when Iran threatened to close the Straits of Hormuz a few weeks ago? Why has oil been around 100 dollars for a long time, despite Libya being peaceful again?
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    Oil is finite. Our demand for it is not. The entire fabric of human civilization is now entirely dependent upon oil, and in the grand scheme of things we're burning through it about as fast as we can, and emerging economies are catching on to the hype too.

    There may be little ups and downs, but these short term fluctuations are ultimately irrelevant, as the trend is undeniable and inevitable: petroleum will always be more expensive than it was before.
    Last edited by Neomalthusian; 02-23-12 at 06:18 PM.

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    Re: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    No domestic oil is not cheaper and supply has little to do with price. 60% of oil produced is "owned" by entities that use no oil, mostly hedge funds and commercial banks. Those funds are now attacking oil prices with the "Iran Situation" being the excuse. In the commodities market, the more money chasing oil futures the higher the price gets. It is nothing less than a perversion of the system of supply and demand that needs to be regulated out of existance. The only ones who should be buying oil are those that use it. Until that happens we are at the mercy of the speculators and their enormous wallets.
    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Exactly, and it is not only oil. Even food stuffs are being hoarded like this, jacking up world prices on many essential food stuffs. The 150 dollar oil price a few years back was because of this very speculation.
    So you guys can agree that Speculators are the primary driver of oil price? But even Speculators will adjust the price based an what they "expect" the availability of oil will be, yes? So events in the ME, or even a major oil spill, would drive the price up because Speculators "expect" the supply to be less, yes? And of course this has to be measured against Demand as well.

    Lastly, if Speculators are buying 60% of the oil, where are they buy it from, and what happens with the other 40%? Is the remaining 40% affected by prices set by speculators?
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    Re: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Oil is finite. Our demand for it is not. The entire fabric of human civilization is now entirely dependent upon oil, and in the grand scheme of things we're burning through it about as fast as we can, and emerging economies are catching on to the hype too.

    There may be little ups and downs, but these short term fluctuations are ultimately irrelevant, as the trend is undeniable and inevitable: petroleum will always be more expensive than it was before.
    Meanwhile there is a ton of easy money to be made by buying and holding oil off the market so prices go up even when demand is at a 10 year low. We are being held over the fire by the wealthy yet again and the more they make the more they can bid it up. The system is rigged to benefit the very rich. Exporting 400,000 barrels of gas a day doesn't hurt either.

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    Re: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Exactly, and it is not only oil. Even food stuffs are being hoarded like this, jacking up world prices on many essential food stuffs. The 150 dollar oil price a few years back was because of this very speculation.

    Speculation in the market serves a good purpose as well.


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    Re: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    That's utter bull****. Fear driven when there is nothing going on? It is an excuse, just as Libya was an excuse to keep oil prices up. When major banks have oil tankers sitting around full of oil, just waiting for the oil to go up, then you know that the market under someone's influence.

    When 64% of oil sold in a month went to speculators then you know that the system is broken. When oil went up during the first and second oil crisis, speculators accounted for a minor part of the trade.. that was fear.. that was based on facts.. Today speculators control the prices of oil (and other commodities and bond yields) as they see fit.

    Tell me why oil is now HIGHER than it was when Iran threatened to close the Straits of Hormuz a few weeks ago? Why has oil been around 100 dollars for a long time, despite Libya being peaceful again?
    Banks don't have any oil tankers sitting around..

    Why don't you check the OPEC basket price against Brent Crude and Texas crude.

    Yes.. there is a lot of fear that if Iran is attacked they will destroy the Saudi oilfields only 800 miles from Tehran.

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    Re: Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

    Quote Originally Posted by EagleAye View Post
    So you guys can agree that Speculators are the primary driver of oil price? But even Speculators will adjust the price based an what they "expect" the availability of oil will be, yes? So events in the ME, or even a major oil spill, would drive the price up because Speculators "expect" the supply to be less, yes? And of course this has to be measured against Demand as well.

    Lastly, if Speculators are buying 60% of the oil, where are they buy it from, and what happens with the other 40%? Is the remaining 40% affected by prices set by speculators?
    No one really knows what the future may bring so speculators make their own "news" with their ready cash at the slightest provocation. The 40% goes to those who actually use oil and take delivery. They pay the same "market price" that the 60% bid up with their deep pockets. Eventually they buy all the oil, speculators never take delivery, only the profits.

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