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Thread: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

  1. #171
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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Really? Don't workers have the right to disagree with the Church? Especially the non-Catholics?

    You can answer the same question I ask above.
    Of course they have the right to disagree. They do NOT have the right to expect the Church to pay for something that is abhorrant to the Church. Just as I never expected my former employer to pay for or even allow me to have meat/garlic/onion on campus.
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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    Of course they have the right to disagree. They do NOT have the right to expect the Church to pay for something that is abhorrant to the Church. Just as I never expected my former employer to pay for or even allow me to have meat/garlic/onion on campus.
    Really, so when they pay you, they decide what you can buy. After all, it is their money they are giving to you. Salary is really no different than insurance. Both are you pay, your conmpesation for the work or service provided.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    You are once again comparing apples and oranges. When I pay taxes, it is the decision of public officials as to how to spend it. It is no longer my money. Similarly, salary for services rendered is to be spent as the employees see fit. It is their money.

    However, NOW you are forcing employers to spend THEIR OWN money on something that is abhorrent to them. How you can't see how that is fundamentally different is beyond me.
    No, I'm not. Your benefit package is as much compensation for your labor as you salary. Both are equal.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    My first question is do you realize it is more then just catholics that are opposed to Obama's mandate? For examples, protestants have just come out and sad they will no longer be providing insurance to individuals at their schools because they do not believe in funding abortion pills and contraceptives.

    Anyway,of course the employees have the ability to disagree. They can take the money they earn from working and spend it on whatever the heck they want, including contraceptives. However, I really ma not sure what that has to do with forcing religious organizations to provide coverage to their employees for things specifically against their beliefs.

    You seem to think those two actions are the same. They aren't.
    It doesn't matter if it is or isn't only Catholics.

    And what it has to with it is that insurance is compensation. Insurance is part of the salary package. Both is the employers money being given to the employee for services rendered. There is no difference between the two. Don't believe me? Go negotiate your pay some time.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    You didn't really answer the question. You seem to me to be confused. Are you talking about what was said years agoe, or the panel now? And if now, exactly what did he get wrong?
    Oy. Stewart is claiming that the Catholic Church says a[n erection] is a need, but not getting pregnant is more of a want. That's not at all what the catholic church is saying.

    Do you think he realizes they aren't saying that and is just trying to fool his viewers, or do you think he really believes that is what they are saying and he is just clueless?

    Since you seem so confused either Jon purposely fooled you or Jon really doesn't have any idea and accidentally fooled you. I'm still not certain.

    They are simply stating that viagra is to correct something that is medically wrong with an individual. Pregnancy is not a medical problem.

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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    Oy. Stewart is claiming that the Catholic Church says a[n erection] is a need, but not getting pregnant is more of a want. That's not at all what the catholic church is saying.

    Do you think he realizes they aren't saying that and is just trying to fool his viewers, or do you think he really believes that is what they are saying and he is just clueless?

    Since you seem so confused either Jon purposely fooled you or Jon really doesn't have any idea and accidentally fooled you. I'm still not certain.

    They are simply stating that viagra is to correct something that is medically wrong with an individual. Pregnancy is not a medical problem.
    He showed an old clip and said exactly what you claim.

    However, contraceptions, like viagra, have other medical uses as well. The Church oddly decides to ignore those, but not ignore the medical uses of Viagra. So what you mean is that you did not understand what Stewart was saying, leap off on your own misunderstanding, and wrong suggested his viewers were doing what you were doing? Is that it?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    It doesn't matter if it is or isn't only Catholics.
    You are correct in a way. But you keep singling out catholics. You need to broaden it to many different relgions.

    And what it has to with it is that insurance is compensation. Insurance is part of the salary package. Both is the employers money being given to the employee for services rendered. There is no difference between the two. Don't believe me? Go negotiate your pay some time.
    There is a difference between providing an employee with money to spend as they see fit and forcing a church related organziation to directly give things that are against their beliefs to their employees.

    Would you force a muslim related organization to provide free pork to their employees? I wouldn't. However, if someone that works at the muslim organization wants to buy pork with his salary? fine.
    Last edited by buck; 02-22-12 at 12:28 PM.

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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    He showed an old clip and said exactly what you claim.

    However, contraceptions, like viagra, have other medical uses as well. The Church oddly decides to ignore those, but not ignore the medical uses of Viagra. So what you mean is that you did not understand what Stewart was saying, leap off on your own misunderstanding, and wrong suggested his viewers were doing what you were doing? Is that it?
    Obama didn't come out with a mandate that religious organizations have to provide free viagra to all of their employees. The only people that will have viagra provided by their insurance companies are those with an actual medical need. The same can not be said about contraceptives and morning after pills.

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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    Obama didn't come out with a mandate that religious organizations have to provide free viagra to all of their employees. The only people that will have viagra provided by their insurance companies are those with an actual medical need. The same can not be said about contraceptives and morning after pills.
    Not the point. The point is, for males and viagra, they skipped concern over the objectionable part. For women and contraception, they skipped concern for the medical uses. This is the point.

    And no, viagra, once allowed as part of the plan, can be used however the patient sees fit. There is no functional difference between the two

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  10. #180
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    Re: Angry lawmakers challenge lineup at hearing: 'Where are the women?'

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    You are correct in a way. But you keep singling out catholics. You need to broaden it to many different relgions.
    As I am a Catholic, I feel quite free to keep singling them out.



    There is a difference between providing an employee with money to spend as they see fit and forcing a church related organziation to directly give things that are against their beliefs to their employees.

    Would you force a muslim related organization to provide free pork to their employees? I wouldn't. However, if someone that works at the muslim organization wants to buy pork with his salary? fine.
    There is no difference. Because with the insurance, they are not choosing to have contraceptions. The employee is. You don't just get them handed to you. You have to go and get them, using your individual choice, with your compensation, just as you do with the money in pay check. No difference.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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