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Thread: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    right

    Affirmative action refers to policies that take factors including "race, color, religion, gender, sexual orientation or national origin into consideration in order to benefit an underrepresented group.

    Now how do we determine if a group is underrepresented?
    But you can't have a quota. The person must be qualified. And you cannot, by law, make race a deciding factor.

    And again, quotas are and have been illegal.

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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Not with a quota...

    A quota is what people illegally set AFTER they determine a group is under-represented.

    Try again.
    you are dodging. you seem to not want to explain how group representation is figured. I would do it by calculating the proportional part or share of the total amount or quantity. Does that sound like a reasonable way to determine representation?

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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    How is making it a rule that we should judge a person solely on ability, no longer a useful rule?
    Because when that is the only rule, people don't actually follow it. Outlawing discrimination doesn't stop it from happening. AA was enacted and is carried out based on the extremely correct assumption that prejudice and bigotry will still occur, even when they are not socially acceptable, or even legal. AA attempts to tip the scales back into balance.

    I would love to see a society where a person is judged solely on ability. AA moves us closer to that, rather than farther.
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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    you are dodging. you seem to not want to explain how group representation is figured. I would do it by calculating the proportional part or share of the total amount or quantity. Does that sound like a reasonable way to determine representation?
    I'm not dodging. Tet said AA has nothing to do with quotas. You said it does by implying quotas are used to determine under-representation. I let you know that quotas are not used to determine under-representation. Debate solved. Unless you have proof that quotas are used to determine under-representation then we have nothing more to discuss. I'm not interested in whatever new tangent you're on.

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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Affirmative action was always just treating the symptom of the larger problem of poverty and underfunded school systems in minority neighborhoods.
    It is not the symptom, it is the problem. No amount of affirmative action can undo what nature has done. Not all people are truly born equal, except in law. This I believe is accepted by all. Given all then AA in the world cannot 'correct' a certain order of things mandated by nature. Races have evolved with certain strengths to allow them to flourish in specific environments, not unlike Darwin's observations of the Galapagos Islands.

    In order to allow groups to flourish, the natural environment needs to be changed, not the society in which they live. If over 40 years of affirmative action has made nary a dent in this inequality, perhaps a rational-based rethink without PC absurdities may not be out of line.

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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    That would be incorrect.
    then you acknowledge bias remains at play and yet you advocate for the end of a program intended to eliminate that unfair bias
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    I'm not dodging. Tet said AA has nothing to do with quotas. You said it does by implying quotas are used to determine under-representation. I let you know that quotas are not used to determine under-representation. Debate solved. Unless you have proof that quotas are used to determine under-representation then we have nothing more to discuss. I'm not interested in whatever new tangent you're on.
    so far you have only said how we don't calculate under-representation.

    now explain how we do it, since you are positive I have it wrong.

    how do we calculate that a group is underrepresented. explain this to me

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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by Meathead View Post
    It is not the symptom, it is the problem. No amount of affirmative action can undo what nature has done. Not all people are truly born equal, except in law. This I believe is accepted by all. Given all then AA in the world cannot 'correct' a certain order of things mandated by nature. Races have evolved with certain strengths to allow them to flourish in specific environments, not unlike Darwin's observations of the Galapagos Islands.

    In order to allow groups to flourish, the natural environment needs to be changed, not the society in which they live. If over 40 years of affirmative action has made nary a dent in this inequality, perhaps a rational-based rethink without PC absurdities may not be out of line.
    Excuse me, if you're implying that certain races are behind in education because of "nature", then you need to read a book.

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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    then you acknowledge bias remains at play and yet you advocate for the end of a program intended to eliminate that unfair bias
    I acknowledge some biases do exist in some places and do not think affirmative action is the correct solution for those problems any more.
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    Re: Affirmative Action - Could Justice Alito's Vote Change the Game?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I acknowledge some biases do exist in some places and do not think affirmative action is the correct solution for those problems any more.

    then how are the biases overcome
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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