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Thread: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    God damn Marijuana!
    Peter Tosh's ghost won't be happy with you mon

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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    want a solid middle class? then get rid of the dependency dope that addicts so many people to mediocrity
    NEVER and I repeat, NEVER will you stop people from getting high, so good luck getting rid of anything. Just to play devils advocate (and I'm not saying i support it) wouldn't it be more logical that if all drugs were legal that use may still be an issue, distribution would be MUCH less profitable?

    Secondly, are you referring to "dope" as marijuana specifically or drugs in general? I just don't see much social harm in pot.
    Last edited by Midwest Lib; 02-14-12 at 11:28 PM.

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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    I do not think kids should receive cash from tax payers for doing something that they should already be doing.I think it will create some sort of idea that people are supposed to pay you to do things you are already supposed to be doing. It amounts to giving people for not speeding,or giving people money because they paid their bills.
    If these kids drop out (or even if they graduate without actually learning anything), they'll probably cost the taxpayers a lot more than a $25 gift card. It's in the public's economic interests to ensure that students are well-educated, and if small rewards for doing so proves to be effective, I'm not opposed to trying it out. If nothing else, it's cheaper than paying a truant officer to round them up.

    Besides, I think it's good practice for the "real world." It teaches students at an early age that working hard can result in financial reward. For students living in poverty, the vague hope that they'll earn a better-paying job several years hence may not be a visible enough reward; a gift card makes it more tangible and immediate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod
    Yep.

    My motivation was, if I didn't go to school and perform, my dad would have my ass, and my mom would take away every ounce of limited freedom I had. That, and they managed to install enough personal pride and desire to succeed that I took my future into my own hands.

    And no, we weren't wealthy by any stretch.
    Not everyone is fortunate enough to have parents who care about their success.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 02-14-12 at 11:55 PM.
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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Lib View Post
    NEVER and I repeat, NEVER will you stop people from getting high, so good luck getting rid of anything. Just to play devils advocate (and I'm not saying i support it) wouldn't it be more logical that if all drugs were legal that use may still be an issue, distribution would be MUCH less profitable?

    Secondly, are you referring to "dope" as marijuana specifically or drugs in general? I just don't see much social harm in pot.
    you really missed my point

    the dope is that of government handouts (dependency dope)

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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    You can make 10K in a few hours selling drugs on the street or you can go to school and work your ass off to go college, amass student loan debt, and then end up on food stamps because you can't get a job.

    It's funny, all the "capitalists" on this forum, and not a single one of them understands incentive or what kinds of incentives the kids living in poverty experience in this day and age.
    What a load of hogwash this is.

    First, the VAST majority of kids do not get into selling drugs on the street

    Second, if you can make "10k in a few hours" selling drugs on the street and are tempted to do that instead of going to school, I highly doubt a few $25 visa gift cards is going to change that

    Three, Last I checked the majority of college graduates do not end up on food stamps and can't get a job.

    Fourth, there are incentives in life other than simply monetary ones, and the act of learning at a young age helps instill the notion that taking effort to better ones self is one such example. If the very first thing a child does that isn't mildly "fun" is something they're getting paid to do it establishes in them that should they have to do anything that isn't simply for enjoyments sake then they should have to be paid for it.

    Fifth, children are gaining something from school. Education, skills, knowledge, etc. This is not equivalent to "Work" where largely you are performing services or actions aiding others, not yourself directly. There are far better ways that money can be spent in the school system then thinking every child is going to be best and most efficiently and beneficially incentivized by money. Leave that to parents if they so choose to go that route with their child.

    Sixth, alternatively if you feel this is important than you can look into a private school...such as this one...and go with this. It's actually an example of why going with a more choice based education system would be helpful. Those that feel this kind of style would be most beneficial could pay the money themselves to send their kids to such schools and get such bonuses while others can choose a different option. But it has no place in the public school system.

  6. #46
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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    First, the VAST majority of kids do not get into selling drugs on the street
    We were talking about kids in poverty.

    Second, if you can make "10k in a few hours" selling drugs on the street and are tempted to do that instead of going to school, I highly doubt a few $25 visa gift cards is going to change that
    Never said they would.

    Three, Last I checked the majority of college graduates do not end up on food stamps and can't get a job.
    When did you check last?

    Fourth, there are incentives in life other than simply monetary ones, and the act of learning at a young age helps instill the notion that taking effort to better ones self is one such example. If the very first thing a child does that isn't mildly "fun" is something they're getting paid to do it establishes in them that should they have to do anything that isn't simply for enjoyments sake then they should have to be paid for it.
    I'm not disagreeing with ya at all, but the culture of kids in poverty is that materialism is all that matter. Since you missed the impoverished part, a lot of my argument apparently didn't make much sense to you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    The economy will improve under this bill. If a few people die, it will be for the betterament of this country.

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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    This "self made man" fantasy is the biggest load of bullcrap and no one buys it anymore except for old stupid farts. It is statistically proven that wealth has more to do with chance than with work. It is no coincidence that Bill Gates and Steve Jobs were born the same damn year!
    Wealth having more to do with a chance than with work does not equate that "self made man" = fantasy or a big of bullcrap. Anyone "not buying" that becoming a self made man is still possible is frankly ignorant of reality in this country. It absolutely is not a fantasy and still possible to be a self made man in this country. Is it easier to do if you have money already? Absolutely...that's not new, that's been true for centuries. However, NOT having wealth does not mean that its not possible to succeed and still be a self made man. What's fantasy and a load of bullcrap is the vast majority of the inaccurate and downright provably false statements you've made throughout this thread.

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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you really missed my point

    the dope is that of government handouts (dependency dope)
    You're right, I did. My apologies.

    As to your original point, I agree that one should be more driven to work and succeed than be given handouts to eek by in life. I however think a lot of the problem starts at the top. Wage disparities have grown more and more while minimum wage and appreciation for US labor has not. If more wealth weren't accumulated at the very top not as many people would NEED handouts. I don't abhor capitalism, in fact I appreciate it but I am an advocate for a level playing field. The very rich effect policy hugely in this country on both sides of the aisle and there is no way to deny it, agreed?

  9. #49
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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Wealth having more to do with a chance than with work does not equate that "self made man" = fantasy or a big of bullcrap. Anyone "not buying" that becoming a self made man is still possible is frankly ignorant of reality in this country. It absolutely is not a fantasy and still possible to be a self made man in this country. Is it easier to do if you have money already? Absolutely...that's not new, that's been true for centuries. However, NOT having wealth does not mean that its not possible to succeed and still be a self made man. What's fantasy and a load of bullcrap is the vast majority of the inaccurate and downright provably false statements you've made throughout this thread.
    The self made man fantasy is that it is hard work alone, and very little chance at all, that leads to people being successful. The reality is that chance weighs very heavily in success. I was not arguing that nobody is a "self made man", only the notion that self made men got there by hard work alone is a delusion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    The economy will improve under this bill. If a few people die, it will be for the betterament of this country.

  10. #50
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    Re: Cincinnati High School Paying Students To Come To School

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Fourth, there are incentives in life other than simply monetary ones, and the act of learning at a young age helps instill the notion that taking effort to better ones self is one such example. If the very first thing a child does that isn't mildly "fun" is something they're getting paid to do it establishes in them that should they have to do anything that isn't simply for enjoyments sake then they should have to be paid for it.
    That's already the prevailing mindset in this country, for better or worse. How often do ANY of us do things that we don't enjoy if we aren't getting paid? I'm a pretty well-balanced guy, and virtually everything I do for free is geared toward maximizing my enjoyment (even if it's sometimes in a roundabout way). Besides, what's wrong with the principle of getting paid to work hard anyway? I see no reason that we need to shield students from this mindset; it might be good for them.

    Fifth, children are gaining something from school. Education, skills, knowledge, etc.
    These things are often too intangible and too distant for a 15-year-old to appreciate them. A $25 Visa gift card is tangible and immediate.

    This is not equivalent to "Work" where largely you are performing services or actions aiding others, not yourself directly.
    And while that distinction might make perfect sense as an abstract political theory, it's likely to be lost on a high school kid living in poverty.

    There are far better ways that money can be spent in the school system then thinking every child is going to be best and most efficiently and beneficially incentivized by money.
    I don't know if it will work or be effective, but I don't see the harm in trying. We'll never know if some schools don't try it out. I think most of us would agree that it would be worth an extra $25 per student if it actually helped them learn more...the only question is whether actually paying the student the $25 is an effective way to achieve that goal. It hardly seems like an obvious slam-dunk that this experiment won't work.

    Leave that to parents if they so choose to go that route with their child.
    That might work fine at suburban schools, but many students at impoverished inner-city schools do not have any sort of stable family life to provide them with this (or any other) kind of support.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 02-15-12 at 12:17 AM.
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