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Thread: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
    I agree, it is a dumb argument. It is not my argument, it is your argument. You are saying in your post that if congress can regulate interstate travel, particularly boat travel, which is not a right...
    oh, but it IS a right. we have the right, as American citizens, to travel from state to state, without any passports, tolls, or whatever. traveling from point A to point B, within our own nation, is indeed a right. A fundamental one.

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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    I think if anyone suggested that you have to be a member of a church in order to exercise your right to free speech,freedom of the press,peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances then that person would be laughed at.
    Laughed at and laughed out of public for a while, they would be so ridiculed for that they would qualify for a PTSD assessment.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    The courts have heard this often, and not once has it ruled that we cannot regulate weapons. So, you are likely quite wrong about that. As for you militia argument, I'll try not to be too harsh, but it is one sentence. The first part of the sentence cannot be seen as spearate from the second part. The first part sets up the context for the second part. While there is disagreement on what regulate means, there is no disagreement on the context.
    So you have to be a member of the church in order to be in the press,to exercise freedom of speech, to petition grievances to the government or that the right to peaceably assembly only applies to those in a church?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    so you agree with me the federal government's power to regulate arms is rather specious. especially after the gun has been sold to a retail dealer by a wholesaler. I can only buy handguns from a dealer in the same state as me-why should that transaction be subject to federal regulation since the retail sale is not interstate commerce?


    I will tell you why; because the assholes who engaged in outcome based "analysis (FDR wanted to ban mobsters from having machine guns so they started with a ban and worked backwards) to regulate firearms were not intellectually honest nor interested in following the constitution
    Where was the gun you bought in Ohio manufactured? Ohio? No? How did it get to Ohio? Interstate commerce? Thought so.

    At any rate, whether you agree with it or not, commerce clause analysis is what it is. Likewise, the SC recently held that the 2d Amendment provides for a private right of ownership -- not just for the purpose of state militias. I don't particularly agree with that interpretation, but I do recognize that the Supreme Court establishes the law of the land and it's what we have to live with, unless or until they reverse themselves. Oddly enough, I don't see you complaining about THIS conservative SC decision, which overtuned more than a century of precedent. Hypocrite much?

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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    why was the 2nd Amendment written? to provide for the arming of the citizen-Militia, which was spelled out in Article 1 Section 8 of the USC, and further codified in the Militia Act of 1792.

    It wasn't written so folks could have guns to shoot rabbits & trees. It was to make sure the citizen militia was armed and ready to be called up by the GOVERNMENT to help put down rebellion, insurrection, etc etc.

    The Militia is no more. It no longer exists. Its role is now held by the National Guard.
    If we were to revisit the issue, look at intent, reassess the need for that today, I doubt the amendment would hold today. I'm not advocating getting rid of guns, but it is time to end this debate by rewriting it to say what we really do today.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  6. #396
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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    So you have to be a member of the church in order to be in the press,to exercise freedom of speech, to petition grievances to the government or that the peaceably assembly only applies to those in a church?

    if you couldn't keep and bear arms until after you joined the militia that had been mustered and appointed officers it would be pretty worthless. the idea of a militia is sort of like a volunteer fire department. can you imagine if a volunteer firefighter would have to go to the firehouse when the alarm sounded, get training in how to fight fires and issued equipment there before going to the fire?

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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    ...Likewise, the SC recently held that the 2d Amendment provides for a private right of ownership -- not just for the purpose of state militias. I don't particularly agree with that interpretation, but I do recognize that the Supreme Court establishes the law of the land and it's what we have to live with, unless or until they reverse themselves....
    it was a great example of right-wing judicial activism.

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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    This is what bothers me about conservatives. Anything they disagree with judicial activism, and anything they like is proper judgement. Why you can't see the problem with that is mind boggling. The SCOTUS is doing their job. When they do, it means one side will be please and the other unhappy. There is no way around that. Sorry.

    No, I can see where you would have that opinion because in the past I probably have taken those sorts of stances, but now, I can see that both sides of the argument are committing activism when they politically rule. The bottom line is that they need to get back to the Constitution and stop with this.

    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    So you have to be a member of the church in order to be in the press,to exercise freedom of speech, to petition grievances to the government or that the right to peaceably assembly only applies to those in a church?
    James, you can do better than this silliness. Your comparison simply doesn't work. You're going to have make one that actually compares if you want a reasoned response.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: NYC Mayor Conducts Gun-Sale Sting in Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    if you couldn't keep and bear arms until after you joined the militia that had been mustered and appointed officers it would be pretty worthless. the idea of a militia is sort of like a volunteer fire department. can you imagine if a volunteer firefighter would have to go to the firehouse when the alarm sounded, get training in how to fight fires and issued equipment there before going to the fire?
    Congress, in the Militia Act of 1792, called for all white males between the ages of 18 & 45, to be part of the Militia.

    that's a lot of folks.

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