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Thread: State of the Union Address

  1. #1041
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    Re: State of the Union Address

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Perhaps you should ask someone who actually understands corporate ownership

    yes you are, and maybe you should ask Haymarket why he supports the government taking say 350K out of a corporate profit of one million and then the same government taking 40% of the dividends paid to the OWNERS (assuming they are "rich"). What this means is

    start with one million and it is reduced by 350 to 650

    then apply a 40% income tax (Haymarket wants dividends treated the "same" [he ignores this first cut of taxation which of course doesn't apply to your salary] to the 650 distributed as dividends. that is another 260K taken by the government

    so the one million made by the private corporation is diminished by 610 thousand leaving only 390K for the owners

    that pretty much defines a parasitic tax system
    Just to explain why this happens... (to others, TD)

    Double Taxation [on dividends]
    The two taxes that dividends are hit with are corporate income taxes and individual income taxes.

    Corporate Income Taxes
    Corporate income taxes are paid on any profits the company has before it pays dividends. According to the Motley Fool, corporate taxes can exceed 35 percent in the United States.

    Individual Income Taxes
    When the company pays dividends, the individual investors must report those dividends on their income taxes.

    Effects
    The double taxation greatly decreases the amount of profit that reaches and stays in the hands of the investor. According to the Tax Policy Center, if the corporate income tax is 34 percent and the personal income tax rate equals 33 percent, for each dollar of profit to be paid out in dividends, only 44 cents remains with the investor after taxes.

    Considerations
    If the dividend is a qualified dividend, meaning it is paid by a U.S. company or a qualified foreign company and you owned the dividend for a least 61 of the 121 days around the ex-dividend date, they dividend is taxed at the lower capital gains rates rather than your ordinary income tax rate.

    Read more: Why Are Dividends Taxed Twice? | eHow.com Why Are Dividends Taxed Twice? | eHow.com
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  2. #1042
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    Re: State of the Union Address

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Perhaps you should ask someone who actually understands corporate ownership
    That clearly would not be you Turtle since you repeatedly seem ignorant to the fact that a corporation is a legal entity with its own separate legal obligations including taxes. A shareholder who gets dividends from owning that share or shares is a whole different entity with their own legal obligations of taxation. This is been explained to you over and over and over in thread after thread after thread by poster after poster after poster and you simply ignore it and skate on by with blinders on your eyes.

    Again, for at least the tenth time from the Wikipedia article on CORPORATIONS - in fact the opening lines

    A corporation is created under the laws of a state as a separate legal entity that has privileges and liabilities that are distinct from those of its members
    Not that this is going to do any good.
    Last edited by haymarket; 01-27-12 at 11:09 AM.
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    Re: State of the Union Address

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    You know well that there have been dozens of posts explaining why LONG term capital gains are taxed less

    those include

    1) the risk element
    2) to stimulate investment
    3) the diminishing of the investment due to inflation

    and it is why SHORT TERM capital gains are taxed the same as earned income

    what is pathetic is people who are mad that some can avoid having earned income while having no problem with so many voters having no income tax
    All you have done is to make a shorthand drive-by post listing three reasons without any explanation of HOW they do these things because of a lower capital gains tax or why the government should extend a discriminatory and preferential tax rate some 60% lower than other income in the same tax bracket for the top bracket.

    In short, you offered NOTHING.
    In short, you have proved NOTHING.
    In short, you are still spouting beliefs and axioms and not actual evidence which can be verified and proven as true and factual.
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    Re: State of the Union Address

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    That clearly would not be you Turtle since you repeatedly seem ignorant to the fact that a corporation is a legal entity with its own separate legal obligations including taxes. A shareholder who gets dividends from owning that share or shares is a whole different entity with their own legal obligations of taxation. This is been explained to you over and over and over in thread after thread after thread by poster after poster after poster and you simply ignore it and skate on by with blinders on your eyes.

    Again, for at least the tenth time from the Wikipedia article on CORPORATIONS - in fact the opening lines



    Not that this is going to do any good.
    remind me of the number of corporations you own and your stock holdings (rounded to the nearest hundred k)

    we understand why the big government types try to justify this double taxation

    but the fact remains

    the same pool of money is subjected to TWO CUTS by the government and since you want the tax on dividends to be the same as earned income tax (40% for people like me) that means the GOVERNMENT takes more than 60% of that pool of money

    you can pretend its different entities BEING taxed but it is the same ENTITY TAKING the money

    You can spew that you EXPLAINED IT and you still cannot figure out that this does not JUSTIFY such parasitic activity

    Now I will EXPLAIN to you that I am tired of being told that its OK for the government to take that much money to make those who don't have the skill or productivity to actually invest money feel better

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    Re: State of the Union Address

    from Turtle to me

    remind me of the number of corporations you own and your stock holdings (rounded to the nearest hundred k)
    I do not wish to use my personal financial situation as the evidence in this debate. It matters NOT how much stock I own or you own or anyone owns. I own stock. And that is enough said. Unlike others here, I do not base my political positions on if the sun shines on my own ass.


    we understand why the big government types try to justify this double taxation
    One cannot justify what does exist. If your slur about big government types is aimed at me, you are a blind man throwing darts at a target in a different cave altogether. I do not believe in big government - whatever that phrase means to you.

    but the fact remains

    the same pool of money is subjected to TWO CUTS by the government and since you want the tax on dividends to be the same as earned income tax (40% for people like me) that means the GOVERNMENT takes more than 60% of that pool of money
    What do you not understand when you are told the reality over and over again that money is repeatedly taxed over and over and over and over again most often when it changes hands from one entity to a different entity. This is true when it changes hands from a corporations ( a separate legal entity with its own obligations of taxation) to a shareholder ( a separate legal entity with its own obligations of taxation)

    you can pretend its different entities BEING taxed but it is the same ENTITY TAKING the money
    Nobody need to pretend. It is the legal reality of the situation. Double taxation is NOT based on the entity taking the money but on who is paying the money.




    Now I will EXPLAIN to you that I am tired of being told that its OK for the government to take that much money to make those who don't have the skill or productivity to actually invest money feel better
    That is your personal opinion based on your priority of your own personal tax situation.
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    Re: State of the Union Address

    and your position is based on what advances the interests of the party that you work for and the union that you were a member of

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    Re: State of the Union Address

    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    So you'd rather watch a man receive and enema than a woman have an orgasm? Interesting.
    Most of the time I'd rather watch the woman, but I would have to ponder it with Pelosi...
    Last edited by 00timh; 01-27-12 at 11:39 AM.

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    Re: State of the Union Address

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    and your position is based on what advances the interests of the party that you work for and the union that you were a member of
    well, what's wrong with that?

    Originally Posted by johnny_rebson:

    These are the same liberals who forgot how Iraq attacked us on 9/11.


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    Re: State of the Union Address

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    well, what's wrong with that?
    nothing but pretending its the moral high ground over someone who is tired of paying too much taxes is specious

    he derives benefits from his dem masters winning elections and he pretends that is some sort of noble cause that trumps others objecting to paying more taxes so his Dem masters can use that to buy votes

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    Re: State of the Union Address

    Don't forget about Subchapter S Corporations...now that's a fun topic...

    Oh...did I miss the part about Capital Gains being "Income". Sure it's income, but not Ordinary Income. Each are mutually exclusive and are subject to different rules.
    Last edited by Removable Mind; 01-27-12 at 11:32 AM.

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