Page 12 of 31 FirstFirst ... 2101112131422 ... LastLast
Results 111 to 120 of 302

Thread: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

  1. #111
    Sage
    misterman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Last Seen
    02-09-12 @ 08:41 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,913

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    No it doesn't - the Supreme Court decisions apply.
    Exactly - so why are you busy insisting that only the words in the First Amendment matter?

    Courts exist to regulate disputes. Court decisions are not static but move with the interpretation over time. You're statement is still incorrect - The Constitution does not say anything like what you attributed to it.
    The court rulings do.

    Public schools are run by an administrator hired by a school board, to follow federal guidelines and to meet state and federal standards of learning. Again, it's more accurate to say public schools are FUNDED by the government, and then in turn by the taxpayer.
    This idea has been soundly rejected by the courts.

    Wrong again - (purposely perhaps?) Teaching children religion in public schools does NOT violate the establishment clause, it violates Case Law.
    Good luck in court.

    You're ignorance on both case law and the Constitution are seemingly limitless. Please, post more so I can correct you.
    You don't get to use both. Pick either case law or your own version.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

  2. #112
    Noblesse oblige
    Ockham's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    New Jersey
    Last Seen
    01-27-17 @ 07:23 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    23,909
    Blog Entries
    4

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
    And the answer to that question is no. The Wiccan was not allowed the same privileges.
    And that is the problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
    The school officials ought to know better. This situation comes up in the county where I live occasionally. A Christian group asked for permission to use the facilities for a "Fun with Faith" group and was granted permission. In another instance, the Board of Supervisors traditionally opened their meetings with a prayer. In the interest of fairness, a roster was kept and rotated, until a Wiccan showed up. In both cases permission was denied for other groups. The county was wrong.
    Agreed, either let everyone participate or no one.

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
    The Constitution disallows establishment of an official religion, and denial of any religion equal rights amounts to establishment. For me it is simple as that.
    It also reaffirms that people are free to choose and follow whatever religion as the 1st Amendment states "Freedom OF religion" and NOT "freedom FROM religion". The founders knew at least that there would be multiple religions followed in the future and decided consciously to not promote one over the other. They learned by good old King George's mistakes.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  3. #113
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Last Seen
    03-16-12 @ 11:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,624

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    I didn't ask you about the library. I asked you if your kid came home with Mein Kampf in his backpack and says they gave copies away at school. I dare you to tell my you wouldn't raise an eyebrow that that.
    If it was a part of a large selection of information that kid can pick and choose from, then no, I would not have a problem. I would question the point if it was the one and only item available.

  4. #114
    Sage
    misterman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Last Seen
    02-09-12 @ 08:41 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,913

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    They had the choice to pick them up or not. Should parents be aware these items are available to their kids? Yes they should.
    "Aware" doesn't cut it. Parents should control their child's access to religious materials.

    It's really amazing that conservatives don't get that. They of all people should understand the concept that parents should be able to control their child's exposure to religious doctrine and not have a government-run school override that.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

  5. #115
    Sage
    misterman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Last Seen
    02-09-12 @ 08:41 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,913

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    If it was a part of a large selection of information that kid can pick and choose from, then no, I would not have a problem. I would question the point if it was the one and only item available.
    You may not have a problem with it, but other parents might. And they have that right under the Constitution.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

  6. #116
    Sage
    misterman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Last Seen
    02-09-12 @ 08:41 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,913

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    And that is the problem.

    Agreed, either let everyone participate or no one.

    It also reaffirms that people are free to choose and follow whatever religion as the 1st Amendment states "Freedom OF religion" and NOT "freedom FROM religion". The founders knew at least that there would be multiple religions followed in the future and decided consciously to not promote one over the other. They learned by good old King George's mistakes.
    Schools are not the public square though. You are not the first to mix up the free exercise and establishment clauses in a school setting. It's easy to do.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

  7. #117
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Last Seen
    03-16-12 @ 11:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,624

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    "Aware" doesn't cut it. Parents should control their child's access to religious materials.
    Sure, they should be able to tell the kid to not take them and nobody should interfere with that directive.

    It's really amazing that conservatives don't get that. They of all people should understand the concept that parents should be able to control their child's exposure to religious doctrine and not have a government-run school override that.
    I wouldn't argue they should.

  8. #118
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Last Seen
    03-16-12 @ 11:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,624

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    You may not have a problem with it, but other parents might. And they have that right under the Constitution.
    They certainly have a right to throw it away, send it back, provide alternative selections, etc.

  9. #119
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Last Seen
    03-16-12 @ 11:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,624

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Schools are not the public square though. You are not the first to mix up the free exercise and establishment clauses in a school setting. It's easy to do.
    There are restrictions on schools that do not apply in the public square. The courts have ruled that school can police what students wear. That wouldn't be allowed in the public square.

    A school can allow information to be available to kids as long as noted, they allow all. They do not have to. They can say no also.

  10. #120
    Noblesse oblige
    Ockham's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    New Jersey
    Last Seen
    01-27-17 @ 07:23 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    23,909
    Blog Entries
    4

    Re: Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Exactly - so why are you busy insisting that only the words in the First Amendment matter?
    Because you were incorrect in attributing it to the Consitution. Say you were mistaken and I drop it, or continue to squirm.

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    The court rulings do.

    Is that your way of admitting your following statement relating to what the Constitution says was incorrect?

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman
    So you have no problem with government-run schools indoctrinating our children with religion?

    (Not that it matters, since the Constitution says you can't anyway).

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman
    This idea has been soundly rejected by the courts.
    i.e., Case Law.


    Quote Originally Posted by misterman
    You don't get to use both. Pick either case law or your own version.
    I choose to use the Constitution which is what you incorrectly stated, prevents indoctrination of children with religion in schools.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


Page 12 of 31 FirstFirst ... 2101112131422 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •