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Thread: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Can you link us to the data showing that TransCanada will ship over land if they can't get the pipeline? Because everything I've seen simply suggests that they will either go with another pipeline route or just deal with slower delivery via the exsisting pipeline.
    How can I link to something that hasn't happened yet?

    However, either way they are working hard at achieving their goal stated by Steven Chu in 2008 "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe."

    Gasoline was $1.81 when Obama took office, it's $3.31 today.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Why did Congress attach XL to the payroll tax renewal anyway? Are the issues related? No. Was Congress ever actually against the payroll tax renewal? No. This was all brinkmanship on the part of the Congressional GOP to force Obama into rejecting it. They didn't like that he put off approval until next year so they whined about it to make some political hay for themselves. Is it any wonder Obama blamed Congress for his decision?

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    The route didn't need to be changed. This was a political delaying tactic to throw red meat to Obama's base voter block...
    The route needed changing until Nebraska was happy with it. If you believe Nebraska would help any Dem with a delaying tactic then you don't know a thing about Nebraska politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    Wrong........most people in Nebraska are very happy with the pipeline and support it.

    Nebraska governor: 'The president made a mistake' - POLITICO.com
    Yes, they supported the pipeline but had serious objections to it's location. Of course, changing the route in Nebraska then changes the route in the Dakotas and now you've got 500+ miles of new routing that needs to be looked at - not something that can be done overnight (regardless of what Governor Heineman thinks). Without final approval nothing gets started so that non-sense about "conditional approval" was just so much political trash from a Republican about a Democrat. If Governor Heineman had no issues then he should have just said so in the first place and let them build XL where they wanted. If he had issues that needed addressing then he shouldn't be blaming Dems for delaying approval and making is easier for him to negotiate.

    And I don't think questioning Canada's doubts about a final pipeline approval will hold water either. Everyone on both sides of the border knows how this will play out. The pipeline will be built, probably starting in 2013. TransCanadian was stupic not to consult with the States being affected before submitting their application. IMO, any delays are their own fault.


    It took Nebraska three years to decide the original route (20% of the project at best) wasn't going to work for them and (almost!) work out a solution for it. Why question the fact it will take Uncle Sam another year to re-work 35% of the project?

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Quote Originally Posted by sharon View Post
    The actual number that will be at least temporarily employed for the pipeline construction is between 3500 and 4200 people...
    That's not what I'm getting from the TransCanada website. Here, check it yourself:

    Keystone Pipeline Project

    Go ahead and share your sources, and we'll compare.

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Quote Originally Posted by Sunbelt View Post
    That's not what I'm getting from the TransCanada website. Here, check it yourself:

    Keystone Pipeline Project

    Go ahead and share your sources, and we'll compare.
    I know.. I have read the TransCanada claims.. Its political hype.. ask any oil man.. He'll laugh his head off..

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    How can I link to something that hasn't happened yet?

    However, either way they are working hard at achieving their goal stated by Steven Chu in 2008 "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe."
    Gasoline was $1.81 when Obama took office, it's $3.31 today.
    I hate facts like those. I have said for a while now, cut gas prices down and you can keep your payroll tax holiday. You will save the average household more money in the long run.
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    How can I link to something that hasn't happened yet?

    However, either way they are working hard at achieving their goal stated by Steven Chu in 2008 "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe."

    Gasoline was $1.81 when Obama took office, it's $3.31 today.
    I seem to recall gasoline at over $4.00 a gallon prior to the recession ... under Bush/Cheney?

    The price crashed due to the recession. Prices have recovered due to the improving economy. Don't know about you, but I'll take higher gas prices and an improving economy versus low gas prices and a putrid economy. It's that old supply<->demand thing.

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    How can I link to something that hasn't happened yet?

    However, either way they are working hard at achieving their goal stated by Steven Chu in 2008 "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe."

    Gasoline was $1.81 when Obama took office, it's $3.31 today.

    Ahhh, you must have attended the Bachmann school of deceit...

    If you go to your link and click on '4 Years' at the top of the chart, things will be put in their proper perspective.

    Gasoline was $4.12 in July 2008.
    “We just simply don’t know how to govern” - Rep. Steve Womack (R-AR) a member of the House Budget Committee

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Yeah, I clicked the 6 year and it showed the 4.12 as well. But then it dropped. Has anyone done the average gas price adjusted for inflation for each president?
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Quote Originally Posted by sharon View Post
    Well.. if you look at a pipeline map of the US.. I don't think we have been too concerned about that in the past.. but on the other hand.. bitumen has the consistency of fudge and has to be diluted to flow.. and I am informed it takes more pipeline pressure.

    I don't really know what the trade-offs are...... but I am inclined to think the pipeline is a poor long term strategy... and more about a beneficial tax structure for the oil companies than a real benefit to either Canada or the US.

    It won't reduce the price at the pump, increase domestic supply or create 20,000 jobs.. That is political hype.. If an oil company can't move a mere 700,000 barrels a day with a small labor force, they need to get out of the business.
    Well stated.

    It is also worth pointing out that bitumen is far more corrosive than standard oil products, and thus more likely to degrade infrastructure, likely part of the reasoning for the 12 leaks last year on the existing pipeline.

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    Re: Keystone oil sands pipeline rejected

    Quote Originally Posted by tecoyah View Post
    Well stated.

    It is also worth pointing out that bitumen is far more corrosive than standard oil products, and thus more likely to degrade infrastructure, likely part of the reasoning for the 12 leaks last year on the existing pipeline.
    Yes, it is... but key to this deal is that Canada has lost control of its own natural resources.. The oil companies are largely own by foreigners and they are avoiding paying taxes in both Canada and the US via NAFTA.. .. and it gets better.

    The oil goes to refineries in Free Trade Zones in Texas and will be refined and exported.

    Canada is getting screwed... that's why they have to IMPORT 43% of their crude oil.

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