• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Romney reveals he pays about 15% in taxes(edited)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Okay, I apologize, but I presented a challenge and now I have to go out for a bit. I will try to answer responses when I get back.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Keridan said:
Okay, folks. My basic stance is that the death tax is a punishment for looking out for your family with income that you were already taxed on.
Click to expand...

My major problem with the estate tax is that people perceive it like... Parents are multi-millionaires and some playboy kid get millions and plays polo, but that isn't always the case.

It hurts small businesses, farmer's, landowners, and people who have invested wisely; People who are not sitting on millions of dollars in cash. The their family has to start selling things (after losing a parent) to pay off some crummy tax.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

from Turtle

carnegie left his wife sums that come up to be over 125 MILLION. the uber wealthy's estates regenerate rather quickly
Click to expand...

So what? Nobody is trying to prevent that. All we are saying - Carnegie included - is that the gift should be subject to taxation.


in cases where grandparents and parents die less than 40 years apart the wealth of the family is diminished, when its less than 20 years the estate often will never recover.
Click to expand...

So what? Where is it written that irresponsible stewardship of inherited money must be protected against or guaranteed over time?


the bottom line-people who argue for the death tax ooze envy or they truly believe that the government NEEDS and is ENTITLED to more and more private wealth
Click to expand...

Playing the right win version of your RACE CARD again.

so why not tax everyone's estates?
Click to expand...

I agree. All transfer of income should be taxed as income. Glad to see you agree.

actually if you want an estate tax it should be directed to those who did not pay federal income taxes during their lifetime

right now it is nothing but a SURCHARGE on the most overtaxed citizens when it comes to federal taxes
Click to expand...

I already said that everyone should pay. Glad you agree.

and the next time any of you whine that you pay a higher federal tax rate than Romney figure out his lifetime federal tax rate with the death tax figured into that
Click to expand...

Since there is no tax on death, what you ask is impossible in the real world we live in.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

ric27 said:
My major problem with the estate tax is that people perceive it like... Parents are multi-millionaires and some playboy kid get millions and plays polo, but that isn't always the case.

It hurts small businesses, farmer's, landowners, and people who have invested wisely; People who are not sitting on millions of dollars in cash. The their family has to start selling things (after losing a parent) to pay off some crummy tax.
Click to expand...

There are healthy exemptions. You need to be aware of them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estate_tax_in_the_United_States#Exemptions_and_tax_rates

as you can see, in this year the exemption if over $5,100,000.00.
 
Last edited:
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

ric27 said:
My major problem with the estate tax is that people perceive it like... Parents are multi-millionaires and some playboy kid get millions and plays polo, but that isn't always the case.

It hurts small businesses, farmer's, landowners, and people who have invested wisely; People who are not sitting on millions of dollars in cash. The their family has to start selling things (after losing a parent) to pay off some crummy tax.
Click to expand...

Currently the first FIVE MILLION you receive in inheritance is not taxable. So we're not talking about somebody who owns a small town gas station or a farm their family works personally, we're talking about chains of stores or massive commercial farms.
 
TurtleDude said:
carnegie left his wife sums that come up to be over 125 MILLION. the uber wealthy's estates regenerate rather quickly
in cases where grandparents and parents die less than 40 years apart the wealth of the family is diminished, when its less than 20 years the estate often will never recover.

the bottom line-people who argue for the death tax ooze envy or they truly believe that the government NEEDS and is ENTITLED to more and more private wealth

so why not tax everyone's estates?

actually if you want an estate tax it should be directed to those who did not pay federal income taxes during their lifetime

right now it is nothing but a SURCHARGE on the most overtaxed citizens when it comes to federal taxes

and the next time any of you whine that you pay a higher federal tax rate than Romney figure out his lifetime federal tax rate with the death tax figured into that
Click to expand...

Dynastys of super rich families are not the American way and will destroy our way of life. If you don't want the Govt. to get your money, give it away to good causes before you die like Bill Gates. 5 million tax free is enough for most to pass on, greed has no end I guess.
 
Last edited:
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

TurtleDude said:
no the real essence of fairness is not taxing ONLY those who already pay massive income taxes

lets get rid of the abomination in its entirety


(and tell me why that is wrong-the people who pay the death tax are the ones who pay 40% of the federal income taxes)
Click to expand...

You are attempting to connect two different things.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Grant said:
It can certainly be discouraging but this is one of those times when we have to put our trust in the collective wisdom of the American voter, provided States allow them to only vote once and the system is reserved for the living.

It was dark days for America when Jimmy Carter was President as well and the left and media bashed Ronald Reagan constantly. But the huge majority saw the truth through this scam and corrected their previous electoral error with quiet enthusiasm. I believe that will happen again with Romney.
Click to expand...

Ya know...i believe Stalin said something about... "He who casts the votes decides nothing. he who counts the votes decides everything"
 
ric27 said:
People want security over freedom and that is where we are getting hammered by socialist politicians and gov't expansion. Voters don't want to have the risk of failure or lose their way of life so they want the government to take the risk out of living. When problems come, turn to the feds.

What was really intended to 'correct' the government was interested and vigilant voters who would elect representatives that held the values of America. The biggest problem now is that people got discouraged and disinterested and now are so apathetic, ignorant, and self-interested that their view is no longer what is good for the country but what is good for me.

How to break that cycle?
Click to expand...

Change you party affiliation. Send in your old voter registration card. Look for reasoned alternatives to the status quo. Or just keep supporting the same people. Look...the '99%' e's railed on about bribe and corruption. And at the end of the day...they still vote for the biggest recipients of the bribes and corruption. That makes a ton o sense.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

randel said:
no such thing as a 'death' tax...
Click to expand...

Yeah I know what the Union position is

but this silly bit of denial is just that-Silly Sure, people like you who want the government to take money from others call that abomination as palatable a term as you can.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

haymarket said:
There are healthy exemptions. You need to be aware of them.

Estate tax in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

as you can see, in this year the exemption if over $5,100,000.00.
Click to expand...

Yeah but greedy wealth stealers want it to go back to one million. after all, the attitude is

1) the rich don't deserve their wealth or their wealth is subject to the "needs" of the many

2) the government needs it more

your position is obvious and I doubt you would object to the threshold being 1 million or the rate being 90%
 
iguanaman said:
Dynastys of super rich families are not the American way and will destroy our way of life. If you don't want the Govt. to get your money, give it away to good causes before you die like Bill Gates. 5 million tax free is enough for most to pass on, greed has no end I guess.
Click to expand...

actually I tire of the mindset that is always looking for OTHERS to pay more taxes and One million is hardly super rich. 5 million isn't super rich. You are the greedy one-you want to tax people who are more industrious and thrifty than your family is
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

haymarket said:
You are attempting to connect two different things.
Click to expand...

the death tax is a surtax on those who pay the most income tax. its time to get rid of it
 
iguanaman said:
Dynastys of super rich families are not the American way and will destroy our way of life. If you don't want the Govt. to get your money, give it away to good causes before you die like Bill Gates. 5 million tax free is enough for most to pass on, greed has no end I guess.
Click to expand...


What if Steve Jobs stopped once he hit 5 Mil and just lived off dividends. Where is the development. You are encouraging the most productive in our society not to produce. Bad position because you think their family doesn't deserve the money.
 
Blue_State said:
What if Steve Jobs stopped once he hit 5 Mil and just lived off dividends. Where is the development. You are encouraging the most productive in our society not to produce. Bad position because you think their family doesn't deserve the money.
Click to expand...

that also encourages high earners to blow it rather than save for their kids. its idiotic to punish saving and thrift.

My father earned well over a million a year and drove Oldsmobiles, often until they quit running. Lots of his friends drove expensive sports cars, took expensive vacations all over the world, at at fancy restaurants rather than middle of the road places like we did. Yeah and when my father and mother died, we had a much bigger estate than kids I grew up with whose parents made as much as mine. but according to the parasite mentality, we ought to pay much more taxes
 
Blue_State said:
What if Steve Jobs stopped once he hit 5 Mil and just lived off dividends. Where is the development. You are encouraging the most productive in our society not to produce. Bad position because you think their family doesn't deserve the money.
Click to expand...

As a rule dead people don't produce much.
 
TurtleDude said:
that also encourages high earners to blow it rather than save for their kids. its idiotic to punish saving and thrift.

My father earned well over a million a year and drove Oldsmobiles, often until they quit running. Lots of his friends drove expensive sports cars, took expensive vacations all over the world, at at fancy restaurants rather than middle of the road places like we did. Yeah and when my father and mother died, we had a much bigger estate than kids I grew up with whose parents made as much as mine. but according to the parasite mentality, we ought to pay much more taxes
Click to expand...

There is no evidence to support the proposition that having children makes people more productive. In my experience big-time earners don't really care that much about money. They just tend to be hypercompetitive, ego-driven people who think of it as a game. It doesn't matter to them if they've made more money than they could ever realistically spend.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Keridan said:
Okay, folks. My basic stance is that the death tax is a punishment for looking out for your family with income that you were already taxed on. I'm not hyper-partisan or even really right wing. Show me those arguments and let's discuss. I apologize for my laziness, but I'm not going back through 177 pages in this thread and every other thread to find the arguments. Please bear with me and present those arguments succinctly again.

As for the semantics of the name, you can call a stable the Mariott, but that doesn't stop it from smelling like poop and I won't look forward to staying there. I don't call lots of government programs by their presented name. Convince me this isn't a barn full of dung and fat animals.
Click to expand...
The fact is that virtually everyone pays taxes on money they paid taxes on. Like state, local and payroll taxes and many more, estate taxes are just a different category.
 
AdamT said:
As a rule dead people don't produce much.
Click to expand...

I guess you are ignorant at how much royalties Admiral Morrison received from his dead son's record sales or that Jimi Hendrix's father only became a millionaire after Jimi croaked?

those two stars produced close to a billion in sales long after they died!!!
 
TurtleDude said:
I guess you are ignorant at how much royalties Admiral Morrison received from his dead son's record sales or that Jimi Hendrix's father only became a millionaire after Jimi croaked?

those two stars produced close to a billion in sales long after they died!!!
Click to expand...

So there are exceptions to every rule.
 
AdamT said:
There is no evidence to support the proposition that having children makes people more productive. In my experience big-time earners don't really care that much about money. They just tend to be hypercompetitive, ego-driven people who think of it as a game. It doesn't matter to them if they've made more money than they could ever realistically spend.
Click to expand...

well I certainly save for my son and that is my main motivation to be thrifty and save. I could have retired at 40 and have the same lifestyle I have now but I keep working for my son.

but perhaps you should limit your evaluations of people you are actually familiar with.
 
TurtleDude said:
well I certainly save for my son and that is my main motivation to be thrifty and save. I could have retired at 40 and have the same lifestyle I have now but I keep working for my son.

but perhaps you should limit your evaluations of people you are actually familiar with.
Click to expand...

I wasn't talking about you. If I was I would have said that you don't do people any favors by giving them a lot of unearned wealth.
 
AdamT said:
See above.
Click to expand...

Sorry I read your comments this way, so I want to clarify your position. If given the means, you wouldn't want to provide for your children and their children? You don't want them to have the means for the best after you busted your ass for x amount of years?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom