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Thread: Romney reveals he pays about 15% in taxes(edited)

  1. #371
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    Re: Romney reveals he pays about 15% in taxes(edited)

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    As far as my opinion goes, yep, I sure do. He challenges Congress to contribute to the U.S. Treasury...says he'll match it. He crows about how people who make over $1 million a year should pay more taxes. If he really wanted to make a difference, he'd be the world's strongest advocate for tax reform -- not simply raising rates.

    Oh, and let's not forget that the third-richest man in the world takes a salary of only $100,000 in order to minimize his taxes.

    and Buffett wants not just the uber rich (the ones where their effective tax rates are actually lower than the semi-rich) but the upper middle class on up to pay more taxes. he wants people who have estates of a few million to be zapped by the death tax and those making a few hundred k to a few million to pay much more taxes.

  2. #372
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    Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhapsody1447 View Post
    It totally matters, if it came from their own capital, that money was already taxed as income when it was earned. If the returns came from profits in a hedge fund/private equity vehicle that earns profits on investor's money than they are paying 15% tax on new, personal income.

    EDIT: Why do you think the government discriminates by the source of income in the first place? Just to stick it to the little guy?
    WRONG.

    He is NOT being taxed on the principal amount which was invested upon which he already paid tax. He is only taxed on the gains from the investment. That is a completely different amount of money over and above what he previously had and was taxed upon.

    Why do I think the rates are discriminatory? I think a great deal of it has to do with the Golden Rule.
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  3. #373
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    Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    WRONG.

    He is NOT being taxed on the principal amount which was invested upon which he already paid tax. He is only taxed on the gains from the investment. That is a completely different amount of money over and above what he previously had and was taxed upon.
    Of course. The double taxation argument is silly. It's not like there's a block of money out that there that has a boolean taxed/not-taxed switch. If you earn money in your job, that money is taxed. If you take your after tax income and use it to start another business, it doesn't mean that your business doesn't then have to pay taxes just because you paid taxes on the start up capital.

  4. #374
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    Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    WRONG.

    He is NOT being taxed on the principal amount which was invested upon which he already paid tax. He is only taxed on the gains from the investment. That is a completely different amount of money over and above what he previously had and was taxed upon.

    Why do I think the rates are discriminatory? I think a great deal of it has to do with the Golden Rule.
    That's correct, after all it's called a capital gains tax. When you buy an asset for $x and sell it for $y you pay the tax on $y-$x.

  5. #375
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    Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

    Of the 1%, by the 1%, for the 1%

    "Americans have been watching protests against oppressive regimes that concentrate massive wealth in the hands of an elite few. Yet in our own democracy, 1 percent of the people take nearly a quarter of the nation’s income—an inequality even the wealthy will come to regret."

    "It’s no use pretending that what has obviously happened has not in fact happened. The upper 1 percent of Americans are now taking in nearly a quarter of the nation’s income every year. In terms of wealth rather than income, the top 1 percent control 40 percent. Their lot in life has improved considerably. Twenty-five years ago, the corresponding figures were 12 percent and 33 percent. One response might be to celebrate the ingenuity and drive that brought good fortune to these people, and to contend that a rising tide lifts all boats. That response would be misguided. While the top 1 percent have seen their incomes rise 18 percent over the past decade, those in the middle have actually seen their incomes fall. For men with only high-school degrees, the decline has been precipitous—12 percent in the last quarter-century alone. All the growth in recent decades—and more—has gone to those at the top. In terms of income equality, America lags behind any country in the old, ossified Europe that President George W. Bush used to deride. Among our closest counterparts are Russia with its oligarchs and Iran. While many of the old centers of inequality in Latin America, such as Brazil, have been striving in recent years, rather successfully, to improve the plight of the poor and reduce gaps in income, America has allowed inequality to grow."

    Of the 1%, by the 1%, for the 1% | Society | Vanity Fair
    Last edited by Catawba; 01-19-12 at 08:37 PM.
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  6. #376
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    Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Of course. The double taxation argument is silly. It's not like there's a block of money out that there that has a boolean taxed/not-taxed switch. If you earn money in your job, that money is taxed. If you take your after tax income and use it to start another business, it doesn't mean that your business doesn't then have to pay taxes just because you paid taxes on the start up capital.

    No, that's true...But we should want to encourage investment should we not?


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    Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    WRONG.

    He is NOT being taxed on the principal amount which was invested upon which he already paid tax. He is only taxed on the gains from the investment. That is a completely different amount of money over and above what he previously had and was taxed upon.

    Why do I think the rates are discriminatory? I think a great deal of it has to do with the Golden Rule.

    the real golden rule when it comes to economics is this

    If you have the gold you make the rules

  8. #378
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    Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Of course. The double taxation argument is silly. It's not like there's a block of money out that there that has a boolean taxed/not-taxed switch. If you earn money in your job, that money is taxed. If you take your after tax income and use it to start another business, it doesn't mean that your business doesn't then have to pay taxes just because you paid taxes on the start up capital.
    I actually agree-if you earn money, pay taxes on it, invest it-it is not double taxation to pay taxes on the income you derive from either dividends or capital gains. what is double taxation is a death tax or taxes on dividends if the corporate profit was first taxed

  9. #379
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    Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Of the 1%, by the 1%, for the 1%

    "Americans have been watching protests against oppressive regimes that concentrate massive wealth in the hands of an elite few. Yet in our own democracy, 1 percent of the people take nearly a quarter of the nation’s income—an inequality even the wealthy will come to regret."

    "It’s no use pretending that what has obviously happened has not in fact happened. The upper 1 percent of Americans are now taking in nearly a quarter of the nation’s income every year. In terms of wealth rather than income, the top 1 percent control 40 percent. Their lot in life has improved considerably. Twenty-five years ago, the corresponding figures were 12 percent and 33 percent. One response might be to celebrate the ingenuity and drive that brought good fortune to these people, and to contend that a rising tide lifts all boats. That response would be misguided. While the top 1 percent have seen their incomes rise 18 percent over the past decade, those in the middle have actually seen their incomes fall. For men with only high-school degrees, the decline has been precipitous—12 percent in the last quarter-century alone. All the growth in recent decades—and more—has gone to those at the top. In terms of income equality, America lags behind any country in the old, ossified Europe that President George W. Bush used to deride. Among our closest counterparts are Russia with its oligarchs and Iran. While many of the old centers of inequality in Latin America, such as Brazil, have been striving in recent years, rather successfully, to improve the plight of the poor and reduce gaps in income, America has allowed inequality to grow."

    Of the 1%, by the 1%, for the 1% | Society | Vanity Fair
    maybe that is because those in the middle class who have seen their wealth rise are no longer counted as members of the middle class

  10. #380
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    Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    maybe that is because those in the middle class who have seen their wealth rise are no longer counted as members of the middle class
    How many? One out of thousand? Can you quantify your supposition?

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