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Thread: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    A republic protects the rights of all. You are asking that a group of people give up rights for your calls and pays for those calls to boot.
    You seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of democracy. Every issue will have people on both sides. There is never 100% agreement. Thus, the majority rules, or should if the government is being responsive to the people.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    No that is the yoke you dishonestly want to hang around your opponents necks. Man, you guy's are gonna be cryin' when Obama, and the whole Chicago thug gang are booted out.

    j-mac
    Well then I'm all ears. If you don't oppose environmental protection, why wold you want to abolish the Environmental Protection Agency? And if you don't oppose consumer financial protection, why would you oppose the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau?

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Excuse me? The CFPB is primarily tasked with improving transparency in financial transations so that less sophisticated borrowers (and they are almost all less sophisticated than the bankers) aren't taken advantage of.
    A contract is to be understood by both sides. If you can prove, which you can't, that people are being tricked into loans they can't afford and aren't just incompetent you don't need an agency to do so that dictates terms of how contracts are to be formed.

    They will also provide consumer education, and enforce anti-discrmination laws.
    I disagree with those types of discrimination laws as I should be able to determine who I wish to do business with for whatever reason I desire. That is the part of what makes us free. Treating it like I can't decide who I want to business with doesn't allow me to practice my property rights and treats me like a slave to others wishes and desires with my property and my time.

    Second, the government doesn't need to educate on how to do business. They just need to learn to read contracts and understand their own limits which they can do on their own. If they can't, the banks can just have policies that put them out of the equation fixing the problem like they did before the government decided they were wrong. Education on the matter is not necessary and an unneeded expense.

    Yes, it is like saying that, although I wouldn't put it so hyperbolically. Generally speaking, people who oppose the EPA want to benefit industry by loosening environmental regulations.
    Nope. Most want laws against harm, not control of industry, everyday life and the rights of people which is what the EPA offers.

    And people who oppose the CFPB want to benefit the financial industry by allowing them to use unfair and deceptive trade practices.
    Hardly.
    Last edited by Henrin; 01-09-12 at 08:08 PM.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    You seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of democracy. Every issue will have people on both sides. There is never 100% agreement. Thus, the majority rules, or should if the government is being responsive to the people.
    The government can represent all people by protecting their rights and liberties. Trying to enact forces on people fails at that purpose and exactly where problems begin.
    Last edited by Henrin; 01-09-12 at 08:04 PM.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    A contract is to be understood by both sides. If you can prove, which you can't, that people are being tricked into loans they can't afford and aren't just incompetent you don't need an agency to do so that dictates terms of how contracts are to be formed.
    Did you miss the financial crisis? Great Recession ring any bells? Never read any of the hundreds of stories about people who were sold ARMs with balloon payments? Have you ever bought a house yourself? Do you think you understood the 30 or so pages of six-point legalese in the contract? I'll bet you didn't. That's no slam against you; almost no one does. But people buy houses every day and generally have to trust the bank or mortgage broker that there are no hidden surprises. Same goes for credit cards and all sorts of other transactions. I don't know about you, but every few months I get a "privacy statement" or something of the sort from a credit card company announcing changes to the terms of the credit card contract. Again, it's page after page of complex legalese that most people simply don't have the education to understand.


    I disagree with those types of discrimination laws as I should be able to determine who I wish to do business with for whatever reason I desire. That is the part of what makes us free.
    I doubt you would feel that way if YOU were the one being discriminated against. If that was the case I don't think you'd feel that the absence of discrimination laws made you free at all. In fact I think you'd feel kind of like a slave, or second class citizen.

    Second, the government doesn't need to educate on how to do business. They just need to learn to read contracts and understand their own limits which they can do on their own. If they can't, the banks can just have policies that put them out of the equation fixing the problem like they did before the government decided they were wrong. Education on the matter is not necessary and an unneeded expense.
    I assure you that it's very necessary. In any transaction involving a giant financial institution and a typical consumer there is a huge imbalance of power and knowledge in favor of the financial institution. You want to hire a lawyer every time you buy a toaster?
    Last edited by AdamT; 01-09-12 at 08:13 PM.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    The government can represent all people by protecting their rights and liberties. Trying to enact forces on people fails at that purpose and exactly where problems begin.
    In most cases when you protect one persons right you are infringing on someone else's right.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    You seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of democracy. Every issue will have people on both sides. There is never 100% agreement. Thus, the majority rules, or should if the government is being responsive to the people.

    This is a fundamental misunderstanding of what the United states is. We are NOT a democracy.

    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    In most cases when you protect one persons right you are infringing on someone else's right.
    Punishing of violations of the rights surely details stripping some rights of that person in most cases, yes. Beyond criminals, the answer is no.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    This is a fundamental misunderstanding of what the United states is. We are NOT a democracy.

    j-mac
    We are a representative democracy.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    We are a representative democracy.
    Nope, still wrong. Try again...


    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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