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Thread: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    In my opinion the rules of the game should be followed. But Republicans were not following the rules. They have been abusing the ever living **** out of the filibuster rule for five years, and in this case they completely abused the advice and consent rule by admittedly using it to try to force a change in existing law, as opposed to the legitimate purpose of vetting the candidate. So when you throw out the rule book, don't whine like a ****in baby when your opponent doesn't follow the rules either. Clear enough?
    But the reality is that the Republicans were following the the same rules that Reid and the Democrats had accepted/followed when Bush was in office. Obama elected to circumvent all established Senate policy to satisfy his own whims. Not really what most would view as a "presidential" action.

    Are you really that clueless....??


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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    I agree. Unfortunately Republicans started jacking with the rules 2006 and they haven't stopped yet. If they had real questions about Obama's appointment I would be the first to cry foul. They should have the right to question him. But, again, they don't have a problem with the nominee. They have a problem with the law that was passed and they were trying to circumvent the advice and consent process to get a second bite at that apple. It's like trying to rob a store and complaining when the owner shoots you with an unregistered handgun. I can't get too worked up about the handgun.
    You really need to do a little research on the topic.


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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cole View Post
    But the reality is that the Republicans were following the the same rules that Reid and the Democrats had accepted/followed when Bush was in office. Obama elected to circumvent all established Senate policy to satisfy his own whims. Not really what most would view as a "presidential" action.

    Are you really that clueless....??
    I'm not aware of any occasion where the Democrats refused to sign off on a nominee because they didn't approve of the AGENCY that the person was nominated for. Can you provide some links?

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cole View Post
    You really need to do a little research on the topic.
    No, I really don't. But thanks for your suggestion.

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    If Boehner or somebody wants to take it to court they're free to, but I can tell you right now, the court will say it's ok. The clear purpose of the recess appointments clause it to enable the president to ensure that vacancies in key positions get filled promptly to avoid disrupting the government's ability to function. That is exactly what it is being used for and the courts won't let some technicality the legislature cooked up trump the clear intention of the constitution. The advice and consent requirement is there to make sure that the legislature gets input into the process, not as a level they can use to try to disable the federal government.
    Last edited by teamosil; 01-06-12 at 01:16 AM.

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    Re: Obama defies Congress with ‘recess’ picks

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    I prefer the one term Marxist president Barack Hussein Obama.

    I think he would be more comfortable with the title of Emperor and Dictator for life.

    But I could be mistaken.
    This statement is the ultimate irony. Let me tell you why:

    1) The father of Neoconservatism was Irving Kristol, who WAS a REAL card carrying member of the Communist Party when he attended college in New York.

    2) The other lynchpin of Neoconservatism was Leo Strauss, the professor at the University of Chicago, who taught and advocated a policy called Noble Lies, in which, to get a population to go along with you, you had to tell them lies, which would supposedly be for their own good. Invented by Plato, Noble Lies was used by Machiavelli, and also..... get ready for it...... Karl Marx.

    3) President Bush had a LOT of Neoconservatives in his administration.

    4) I never once saw you call Bush a Marxist..... EVER!

    I had my own word for the Neocons, though. I called them Bushneviks. LOL.

    Last edited by danarhea; 01-06-12 at 01:36 AM.
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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    A lot of us have, and it's clear that the President's action is in response to the Republicans playing games with the meaning of session in order to game the system and get another bite at the Consumer Protection Agency. This, by the way, is a new tactic. This is the first time the GOP house has pulled it.

    The GOP lost the legislative battle to emasculate the Consumer Protection agency two years ago. In the interim, they've made no secret of their intention to hold the director's nomination hostage to renegotiating the deal on their terms. They started with an ugly series of attacks on Elizebeth Warren. The got her off the short list, and probably cost them a seat in the Senate for their efforts. Now, they're playing the same game with Cordorey.

    The GOP will have to go to court to prevent the President for exercising this appointment. Will the conservative court, side with the GOP and enjoin the appointment, or reverse it?

    That remains to be seen.

    But, constitutional issues aside, politically, that battle will make the GOP look bad. Most people want a consumer protection agency. They're tired of "tricks and traps", as Ms Warren says. And a battle against an agency that wants to do something about them is not a great battle to fight in an election year, particularly if the Adminstration drags the proceedings out through the season.

    Face it, the GOP just fell into its own trap again!

    Weather the GOP can continue to get away with it depends on how (or whether) the courts decide. In any case, the case won't be heard u

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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    If Boehner or somebody wants to take it to court they're free to, but I can tell you right now, the court will say it's ok. The clear purpose of the recess appointments clause it to enable the president to ensure that vacancies in key positions get filled promptly to avoid disrupting the government's ability to function. That is exactly what it is being used for and the courts won't let some technicality the legislature cooked up trump the clear intention of the constitution. The advice and consent requirement is there to make sure that the legislature gets input into the process, not as a level they can use to try to disable the federal government.
    Just remember that you said this when there is a republican president and the democrats are playing politics also.
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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Just remember that you said this when there is a republican president and the democrats are playing politics also.
    I supported Bush when he made John Bolton a recess appointment the exact same way.
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    Re: Obama Defies Congress With ‘Recess’ Picks. Could Provoke Constitutional Fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Just remember that you said this when there is a republican president and the democrats are playing politics also.
    The court would certainly decide it the same way if the parties were reversed. The court is majority conservative, but on this kind of thing they've been pretty consistent for a long time.

    Personally, my feeling is that the whole process should be structured differently. There are some positions that are purely executive department positions. IMO those should not even require advice and consent from Congress. The president is in charge of the executive branch and shouldn't be hamstrung in running his own branch by Congress. If it were up to me, we'd pass a constitutional amendment removing the advice and consent requirements for any post inside the executive branch. But, then there are posts outside of it. For example, independent agencies like the FCC or the FEC, and judges. I would retain the advice and consent requirement those and force Congress to get more involved. The people in those posts outlast one presidential administration and IMO they should reflect a more balanced point of view. But, those posts need to be able to be filled much more quickly than they are. I think for those I would put a clock on the advice and consent saying that if they do not reject the nominee within 30 days, they are automatically confirmed.

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