Page 2 of 46 FirstFirst 123412 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 459

Thread: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

  1. #11
    Shankmasta Killa
    TacticalEvilDan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Western NY and Geneva, CH
    Last Seen
    08-30-15 @ 04:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    10,444

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    the bill already says that.
    By all means, show me where it explicitly states that the Executive does not have the power to detain American citizens on American soil indefinitely without trial. Don't show me the where it talks about excluding American citizens from mandatory military detention indefinitely, that's not what I'm talking about.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    why should Obama try to ease the fears of those who have already made their minds about this bill, and likely would simply hand-wave away anything Obama says.
    The point is that nobody involved in supporting this debacle has made any attempt to be explicit -- they've consistently used language that takes a position without taking a position.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    this is what they WANT to believe, and so..they believe it.
    How's that for self-diagnosis, folks? Let's give him a hand!
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  2. #12
    Shankmasta Killa
    TacticalEvilDan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Western NY and Geneva, CH
    Last Seen
    08-30-15 @ 04:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    10,444

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    Quote Originally Posted by 24107 View Post
    Scary how the President of the United States only function is to be nothing more than tool for the real people behind the scenes who really make the decisons.
    I don't think the President is a puppet, I think he's doing what many of his predecessors have done -- amassing as much power for the office as he can.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  3. #13
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    The greatest city on Earth
    Last Seen
    08-04-12 @ 04:27 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    31,089

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    By all means, show me where it explicitly states that the Executive does not have the power to detain American citizens on American soil indefinitely without trial....
    I already did. I won't do it again.

  4. #14
    Sage

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Last Seen
    Today @ 04:41 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    8,180

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    I already did. I won't do it again.
    The non-applicability to US citizens only applies to THE REQUIREMENT to detain them militarily. It is clear his reservations are about not having enough broad authority and flexibility.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    that's not what his reservations are about.
    Yeah it is. The Bill does not give him as much power as he wants. He is talking out of both sides of his mouth.

    The fact that I support this bill as a whole does not mean I agree with everything in it. In particular, I have signed this bill despite having serious reservations with certain provisions that regulate the detention, interrogation, and prosecution of suspected terrorists.
    Against that record of success, some in Congress continue to insist upon restricting the options available to our counterterrorism professionals
    Section 1022 seeks to require military custody for a narrow category of non-citizen detainees who are “captured in the course of hostilities authorized by the Authorization for Use of Military Force.” This section is ill-conceived and will do nothing to improve the security of the United States.
    I have concluded that section 1022 provides the minimally acceptable amount of flexibility to protect national security. Specifically, I have signed this bill on the understanding that section 1022 provides the executive branch with broad authority to determine how best to implement it, and with the full and unencumbered ability to waive any military custody requirement, including the option of waiving appropriate categories of cases when doing so is in the national security interests of the United States.
    Otherwise, investigations could be compromised, our authorities to hold dangerous individuals could be jeopardized, and intelligence could be lost.
    Sections 1026-1028 continue unwise funding restrictions that curtail options available to the executive branch.
    I will exercise all of my constitutional authorities as Chief Executive and Commander in Chief if those procedures fall short, including but not limited to seeking the revision or repeal of provisions should they prove to be unworkable.
    I continue to oppose this provision, which intrudes upon critical executive branch authority to determine when and where to prosecute Guantanamo detainees, based on the facts and the circumstances of each case and our national security interests.
    - President Barack Obama: Dick Cheney on Steroids
    Last edited by Neomalthusian; 01-01-12 at 03:20 PM.

  5. #15
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    The greatest city on Earth
    Last Seen
    08-04-12 @ 04:27 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    31,089

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    ...
    - President Barack Obama: Dick Cheney on Steroids
    alright, well let us know when Obama starts indefinitely detaining American citizens or legal aliens on American soil, without charge or trial.

  6. #16
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Prague, Czech Rep.
    Last Seen
    10-10-12 @ 02:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    1,880

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    APPLICABILITY TO UNITED STATES CITIZENS AND LAWFUL RESIDENT ALIENS.—

    (1) UNITED STATES CITIZENS.—The requirement to detain a person in military custody under this section does not extend to citizens of the United States.

    (2) LAWFUL RESIDENT ALIENS.—The requirement to detain a person in military custody under this section does not extend to a lawful resident
    ..
    e) AUTHORITIES.—Nothing in this section shall be construed to affect existing law or authorities, relating to the detention of United States citizens, lawful resident aliens of the United States or any other persons who are captured or arrested in the United States.
    ..




    bare in mind if this law somehow changed existing law, to now allow for the indefinite detention without trial/charge, of any legal residents of the USA, I too would be yelling bloody murder and probably call for a popular uprising.

    but the fact is, this law changes nothing. No citizens of the USA nor legal residents of the USA, shall be detained indefinitely without charge/trial, due to this law or due to any current law.
    I could care less if the person in question is a citizen, legal or illegal alien, or on a tourist visa or just another frothing terrorist from some forsaken hellhole. If the said person is trying to harm the country or it's citizens, the Bill of Rights should be narrowed to the maximum possible. While I have the greatest respect for the writer of the Constitution and the amendments, in their day they could have not foreseen the possibility of mass destruction nor juries that would free an OJ Simpson.

  7. #17
    Gradualist

    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Last Seen
    09-25-17 @ 12:48 PM
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    34,949
    Blog Entries
    6

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    God damnit Obama.... Acting like Bush i see?
    Just goes to show ya. Dems and Repubs are pretty much the same....


  8. #18
    Sage

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Last Seen
    Today @ 04:41 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    8,180

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    alright, well let us know when Obama starts indefinitely detaining American citizens or legal aliens on American soil, without charge or trial.
    You're apathetic about unconstitutional laws until someone starts wielding them? I figured this was one of the things you would have hated Bush/Cheney for. I'm wrong? You fully supported all their government-growing, unconstitutional terrorism policies?

  9. #19
    Shankmasta Killa
    TacticalEvilDan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Western NY and Geneva, CH
    Last Seen
    08-30-15 @ 04:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    10,444

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    I already did. I won't do it again.
    No, actually, you didn't. You used the same slight-of-hand employed by the bill's supporters in Congress.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  10. #20
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,491

    Re: With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    that's not what his reservations are about.
    He has reservations, because the bill doesn't allow for the indefinite detention of American citizens, without charging them. Can't create a dictatorship without that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

Page 2 of 46 FirstFirst 123412 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •