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Thread: Strait of Hormuz standoff: Iran films US aircraft carrier

  1. #181
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    Re: Strait of Hormuz standoff: Iran films US aircraft carrier

    Khayembii Communique, et al,

    I'm waiting to see what results our actions (military & diplomatic) have in terms of a response.

    Quote Originally Posted by EXCERPTs: CNN Wire Staff
    "We have always stated that there is no need for the forces belonging to the countries beyond this region to have a presence in the Persian Gulf," Brig. Gen. Ahmad Vahidi said Wednesday, the semiofficial Fars News Agency reported. "Their presence does nothing but create mayhem, and we never wanted them to be present in the Persian Gulf."

    "Of course the enemies try to exaggerate this issue in order to secure weapons sales to the counties of this region," he (Cmdr. Amy Derrick Frost, spokeswoman for the U.S. 5th Fleet based in Bahrain) said.

    SOURCE: CNN US updated 11:20 AM EST, Wed January 4, 2012 :Iran says U.S. warships in Persian Gulf spawn 'mayhem'
    Iran says U.S. warships in Persian Gulf spawn 'mayhem' - CNN.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    "If Iran doesn't attack us we will just keep pressuring it until it does. Then we can claim self defense and do whatever we want." - America
    (COMMENT)

    The use of sanctions, at every turn, gets to be old and much the stale threat; particularly when it comes to commodities like oil. No matter how little oil Iran produces, it has an impact on one nation or another. The US should ensure that the actions America takes does not have the inadvertent consequence of imposing additional economic hardships on its allies. The US does not have so many real allies that it can afford to inflict pain on them over a failed Nuclear Proliferation Policy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Multiple Sources
    Quote Originally Posted by EXCERPT: Press TV // SS/HGH/IS
    Seoul's demand for more Iranian oil follows the approval of a new act by the US Senate for imposing tougher sanctions on Iran's financial and energy sectors.

    Ignoring the sanctions, South Korea, which is the world's fifth largest oil importer, is planning to buy 200,000 barrels per day (bpd) of Iranian crude this year, a little more than the 190,000 bpd in 2011.

    SOURCE: PressTV - S. Korea disregards US oil sanctions S. Korea disregards US oil sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by EXCERPT: By Andrew Quinn
    WASHINGTON The United States has armed itself with some of the toughest sanctions yet targeting Iran but must carefully assess how to avoid catching energy-importing allies such as Japan, South Korea and India in the crossfire.

    SOURCE: Thomson Reuters 2012 Posted in: News, U.S., World Jan 3, 2012 7:51 AM ET: Tough new sanctions on Iran could upset U.S. allies
    Tough new Iran sanctions could upset U.S. allies Japan, South Korea, India | News | National Post

    Iran may have a bathtub Navy, but the US has to be careful not to underestimate the hardship it might be able to inflict. While it is generally assumed that in a face-off, the US 5th Fleet would crush the Iranian Navy, it was just this same kind of logic the Philistines had when Goliath was struck down.
    Quote Originally Posted by EXCERPT: By OilPrice.com Team - OilPrice.com
    Iran has earlier warned that if either the U.S. or Israel attack, it will target 32 American bases in the Middle East and close the Strait of Hormuz. On 28 December Iranian Navy commander Rear Admiral Habibollah Sayyari observed, "Closing the Strait of Hormuz for the armed forces of the Islamic Republic of Iran is very easy. It is a capability that has been built from the outset into our naval forces' abilities."

    SOURCE: FX STREET.COM Wed, Jan 4 2012, 10:16 GMT: War Imminent in Straits of Hormuz? $200 a Barrel Oil?
    War Imminent in Straits of Hormuz? $200 a Barrel Oil?

    We will need to be on guard. This could open a second front in the War on Terrorism; using asymmetric means to retaliate against an outside military hegemony. Even when the US obliterates the ability of Iran to project a challenge in conventionally, it would fair well for the underground Islamic World to adopt the plight of Iran in sympathy.

    Most Respectfully,
    R

  2. #182
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    Re: Strait of Hormuz standoff: Iran films US aircraft carrier

    We will need to be on guard. This could open a second front in the War on Terrorism; using asymmetric means to retaliate against an outside military hegemony. Even when the US obliterates the ability of Iran to project a challenge in conventionally, it would fair well for the underground Islamic World to adopt the plight of Iran in sympathy.
    This is a legitimate point.

    It's hard to imagine now, but in the 1970's the US viewed Iran as a vital ally and strenghtened its military as a bulwark against the Russians after the British withdrew from the Persian Gulf in 1971.

    The Shah was unpopular with the mullahs and their young followers, who used these very asymetric tactics against the Americans and the Shah.

    That being said, Iran has not truck with Al Quada, since it is essentially an Arab organization. But they won't sit idly by either.

  3. #183
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    Re: Strait of Hormuz standoff: Iran films US aircraft carrier

    Quote Originally Posted by beerftw View Post
    you really underestimate israel,they have the best spies in the world and are know for being sneaky,they dealt with this problem once before in iraq without raising much attention.
    I'd put British intellegence in the mix as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by beerftw View Post
    not to mention just isreals swift silent response,i am torn between having to go to war with iran,i left active army to go guard.on one hand it could be really fun or it could be like my last deployment that ended six months ago as an expeditionary force building everything out of nothing,which was still fun except the 10 foot cobras deadly pit vipers and monster centipedes,though the scorpions there were quite tiny :/.

    i have faith the problem will be solved unless there is lots of money and fun to be involved!
    I've never been in combat, but I can't imagine there being any fun in going to war...unless you're the ultimate survivalist-thrill junkie. Thus, I hope you're just being sarcastic when using the words "fun" and "war" in the same paragraph.

    To your point, however, you are correct in that certain events of WWI aren't in American history books, i.e., British occupation of Iraq over oil. I'd always believed that the fighting in both WWI and WWII were limited to the north-African region. Until recently, I never knew the fighting had gotten that deep into the Middle-East other than India during WWII. But I digress...

    If we don't handle this Iranian Staits of Hormuz threat the right way, we could find ourselves right back fighting a two-pronged war (which I suspect is what Iran is trying to do...draw us in).

    On a political tip: I find it utterly amazing how so many of the GOP presidential hopefuls are quick to want to attack Iran or call President Obama soft in how he's dealing with them, whereas by all accounts his non-aggressive stance (sanctions) does seem to working. As I've said before, as long as this matter continues to be a U.N. matter and not "America's going solo....again," we should be able to either defuse the situation or worst case not go it alone.

  4. #184
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    Re: Strait of Hormuz standoff: Iran films US aircraft carrier

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorgasm View Post
    So Japan was justified in attacking Pearl Harbor?
    No.

    What happened concerning Japan in leading up to their sneak attack was an oil embargo led by the U.S.. We simply refused to sell them any more oil. A blockade of transit routes in international waters is different.

  5. #185
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    Re: Strait of Hormuz standoff: Iran films US aircraft carrier

    Quote Originally Posted by TomFitz View Post
    This is a reflection of how successful the Obama adminstration's efforts to isolate Iran politically and economically are.

    The Bush adminstration talked the same talk but they couldn't pull it off. They had made so many enemies and alienated so many people over their war in Iraq, that the Iranians were able to play the Americans off against the Russians, Chinese and Europeans.

    The Adminstration mended many of those fences (for which American conservatives condemmed him for "apologizing"). When the Adminstration called for tougher sanctions against Iran two months ago, Britain co opererated and forces Shell to stop buying Iranian oil through a back channel in violation of previous sanctions. Thi is what motivated the attacks oon the British embassy a months ago. Pakistan is delying action on a potential pipeline into Iran under US pressure.

    Iran used the oil weapon against the US in 1973 and again in 1979. But the weak global economy, the explosion in oil from hydraulic fracking in the US, and plentiful supplies gives the international community a chance to turn the tables on Iran. We don't need Iranian oil right now, which gives us the leverage to pressure them economically to end their nuclear program. It is an intelligent policy, one that's as effective as any short of war, and a lot less risky.

    A lot of conservatives like to beat their chests and rant about "going in" to Iran. Iran is three times the size of Iraq. And the last time US leaders beat thier chests and "went in" to a country, things didn't turn out so well.
    I couldn't have said it any better myself!

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    Re: Strait of Hormuz standoff: Iran films US aircraft carrier

    Quote Originally Posted by RoccoR View Post
    Khayembii Communique, et al,

    I'm waiting to see what results our actions (military & diplomatic) have in terms of a response.


    (COMMENT)

    The use of sanctions, at every turn, gets to be old and much the stale threat; particularly when it comes to commodities like oil. No matter how little oil Iran produces, it has an impact on one nation or another. The US should ensure that the actions America takes does not have the inadvertent consequence of imposing additional economic hardships on its allies. The US does not have so many real allies that it can afford to inflict pain on them over a failed Nuclear Proliferation Policy.


    Iran may have a bathtub Navy, but the US has to be careful not to underestimate the hardship it might be able to inflict. While it is generally assumed that in a face-off, the US 5th Fleet would crush the Iranian Navy, it was just this same kind of logic the Philistines had when Goliath was struck down.

    We will need to be on guard. This could open a second front in the War on Terrorism; using asymmetric means to retaliate against an outside military hegemony. Even when the US obliterates the ability of Iran to project a challenge in conventionally, it would fair well for the underground Islamic World to adopt the plight of Iran in sympathy.

    Most Respectfully,
    R
    The issues you've just outlined concerning the balance of sactions against Iran -vs- placing an energy strangle hold on other countries that rely on Iranian oil sets things up perfectly for the U.S. to open our oil reserves for export while also approving oil drilling in Montana AND/OR the KeystoneXL pipeline. Mind you, I'm more for drilling in Montana than I am for approving the pipeline project for the following reasons:

    1. It's domestic oil not more foreign oil. I don't care how friendly Canada has been; it's still foreign oil.

    2. According to reports, everything's ready to go up there except housing. We need to put construction workers back to work, Montana needs housing for their oil boom. Perfect match!

    3. Where there's new housing, there's new community development. There's opportunity abound for new communities to crop up all across Montana which would led to larger economic growth than any one cross-country pipeline could produce.

  7. #187
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    Re: Strait of Hormuz standoff: Iran films US aircraft carrier

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorgasm View Post
    So Japan was justified in attacking Pearl Harbor?
    What international waterways were denied to Japan by the United States?
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  8. #188
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    Re: Strait of Hormuz standoff: Iran films US aircraft carrier

    Quote Originally Posted by TomFitz View Post
    No, it would not. The United States cannot unilaterally decide that it has the right to start a war because another nation interferes with an international trade route.

    If the United Nations were to resolve to use force to break the blockade, than the US could carry out that policy. But the idea that the US can march around interfering here or there on its own whim is false.

    Which is not to say that we just might.
    Incorrect. Traditionally public international law has ALWAYS allowed for a state to protect its legitimate maritime rights with any action necessary, including the use of force. The U.S. (or any other state) has that right and no one has the right to deny access to international waterways. That is legally considered an act of war and has been for centuries.
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