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Thread: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    WTF is wrong with a extension of the payroll tax-cut for 12 months....as opposed to 2 months??

    what's the value in only kicking the can down the road to February?

    why set themselves up for just another fight in such a short period of time?

    pass the Senate plan.....except make it 12 months rather than 2.

    this whole issue, really shows how ****ed up our govt. is.

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    60 days is a political punt, and after average joe voter gets a few minutes to think about it, they'll realize what a bad deal 60 days is.
    60 days was a concession to the Republicans in the senate who refused to do a whole year... The idea is that it gives them time to negotiate a year long deal. I'm betting you already knew that though.

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    Wait, I thought the Democrats told us social security was like an annuity for our retirement. It's not a tax, they said.

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Wait, I thought the Democrats told us social security was like an annuity for our retirement. It's not a tax, they said.
    You've got it backwards. Republicans like to claim it's not a tax so they can make it sound like we have a more progressive tax system than we actually do. But whether you call it a tax or not doesn't matter obviously. You can call it a flying monkey and it will still have exactly the same impact on people's lives it would if you call it a tax.

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    So I recapped the two positons:


    House Bill – HR 3630
    PROVISIONS
    Extends payroll tax cut of 2% for 12 months
    Demands BHO up/down decision on Keystone XL in 60 days
    Extends UI benefits but only to 33wks not 73wks
    Extends Medicare ‘Doc fix’
    Requires GED/training programs for UI
    Prohibits using food stamps for liquor, gambling and strip clubs
    Extends 100 percent business expensing through 2012
    Allows states to drug test for UI benefits
    Eliminates new EPA emission standards for boilers/incinerators
    Mandates SS numbers for Illegal alien children before gov assistance

    FUNDING
    Raises Government Sponsored Enterprise (GSE) guarantee fees to better price the risks GSEs cover and reduce their unfair advantages over the private sector
    Includes spectrum auctions and other reforms to bring in significant revenues for taxpayers by making more efficient and effective use of the public’s airwaves
    Reforms the National Flood Insurance Program by eliminating the pre¬mium subsidy for certain properties
    Better coordinates with states and localities to prevent Social Security overpayments
    Ensures that illegal immigrants who are not eligible to work in the U.S. do not get checks from the IRS Gradually increases Medicare premiums for high income beneficiaries
    Prohibits millionaires from receiving unemployment insurance and food stamp benefits

    Middle Class Tax Relief & Job Creation Act: GOP Plan Extends Current Payroll Tax Relief, Protects Social Security, Reforms and Extends Unemployment Insurance & Includes Key Jobs Initiatives | Speaker of the House John Boehner | speaker.gov



    Senate Bill
    Extends payroll tax cut of 3.1% for 2 months
    Demands BHO up/down decision on Keystone XL in 60 days
    Maintains 99wk UI – extends eligibility 2 mo.
    Extends ‘Doc fix’
    Extend the current law work geographic price cost index
    Extension of Exceptions Process for Medicare Therapy Caps


    Funding
    Uses increased fees on FM/FM
    Uses increased fees on FHA

    Summary of the Two-Month Payroll Tax Cut Extension | Senate Democrats

    Please correct any of the observations listed above. Sure looks like the GOP is overextending...but I guess it is a better place to begin 'negotiations'...?

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Yes, because Employers can really afford to do 60 day tax calculations, and should be expected to plan the coming year based on this Banana Republic style Governing the President and Senate think is a good idea.

    Folks, the HOUSE all ready passed a 12 MONTH extension. The SENATE Dem's made a political calculation and tried to punt to get what they wanted. As a Conservative, of course I'm going to lean automatically towards the lower taxes, but in this case I'll go with the more common sense approach:

    60 days and hope.

    1 Year


    Which of the above helps the economy? Which of the above would give businesses a clear idea of costs and administrative bull**** they will need to figure out for the next 12 months? Which one is truly a job helper, and not a job harming option.


    Pinning this on the GOP is a liberals wet dream, playing heart strings and emotions hoping with the Christmas Season upon us, people will hear the House Rejects a Tax Cut!!! Instead of stopping for that two second heart beat to think about the difference in approaches.


    Carry on my liberal friends, denouncing the GOP for trying to push for 12 month tax policy, instead of 60 day political punts.
    Yes, carry on, you bastion of Liberalism, the Wall Street Journal.

    Ranting about everthing being some kind of evil Leebrul plot is getting old.
    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    Sure looks like the GOP is overextending...but I guess it is a better place to begin 'negotiations'...?
    It isn't the beginning negotiations phase. They began negotiations months ago. The deal was already struck last week. The house GOP said they'd abide by it until the senate left, then they scuttled it for no reason and replaced it with this ridiculous offer knowing full well that it couldn't pass. The only reason they put it out there was so they could pretend that they wanted the tax break. At this point it's too late to fix unless the house gets back in there and votes the senate plan through this week and the house leadership knows that full well. They already agreed to take this deal. The Democrats gave them everything they asked for. Now they're doublecrossing them and the American people with them.
    Last edited by teamosil; 12-21-11 at 06:00 PM.

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    It isn't the beginning negotiations phase. They began negotiations months ago. The deal was already struck last week. The house GOP said they'd abide by it until the senate left, then they scuttled it for no reason and replaced it with this ridiculous offer knowing full well that it couldn't pass. At this point it's too late to fix unless the house gets back in there and votes the senate plan through this week.
    You're going to have to substantiate this. My research revealed that the House bill was passed first. The Senate bill was passed in response to the House bill. This makes Boehner's request for conference legitimate from an SOP position.

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    You're going to have to substantiate this. My research revealed that the House bill was passed first. The Senate bill was passed in response to the House bill. This makes Boehner's request for conference legitimate from an SOP position.
    Oh are you talking about the bill the passed a while back that was rejected by the senate? That was several rounds of negotiation back. Boehner agreed, publicly, to go along with whatever compromise the senate democrats made with the senate republicans. It appears that he intended to stand by his word, but the tea party caucus threatened revolt after the senate left and he caved in and went back on his commitment.

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    Re: Obama says Senate plan ‘only viable way’ to prevent tax hike

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    So I recapped the two positons:


    House Bill – HR 3630
    PROVISIONS
    Extends payroll tax cut of 2% for 12 months
    Demands BHO up/down decision on Keystone XL in 60 days

    [...]

    Please correct any of the observations listed above. [...]
    Sure. The sentence on the Keystone XL pipeline is a falsehood (or at least a lie by omission).

    HR-3630, as passed by the house, demands that Obama approve the pipeline -or- "submit to the Committee on Foreign Relations of the Senate, the Committee on Foreign Affairs of the House of Representatives, the majority leader of the Senate, the minority leader of the Senate, the Speaker of the House of Representatives, and the minority leader of the House of Representatives a report that provides a justification for determination [that the pipeline is not in the national interest], including consideration of economic, employment, energy security, foreign policy, trade, and environmental factors."

    That is not an up/down decision. That is a demand to up, or damn well explain the reason for down (which I assume the Republicans will then argue about). As such it is an insulting directive to the executive branch, that cannot be allowed to stand (for separation of powers purposes if nothing else).

    The bill's language also automatically approves the pipeline if Obama does not act within 60 days, again usurping executive power (and possibly providing a loophole for approval even if Obama disapproves it, given the reporting requirement above).

    http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-1...12hr3630eh.pdf
    Last edited by Karl; 12-21-11 at 06:37 PM.

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