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Thread: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

  1. #211
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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    And that's what he showed you, because that's what you asked for( see your quote from post 134 above ). Now you are stating that the instant a bill has a change within a single house, it doesn't count as an "non-altered bill between houses". That's not what you asked for, and that's not what he gave you.

    He gave you a list of bills that once passed a chamber, were not changed and passed the other chamber.
    False. That's not what he gave me.
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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    It's called moving the goal posts. It's all they have at this point.
    You are the one who moved the goal posts.

    Here is the bottom line, once again - no chamber of Congress simply passes whatever the other chamber sends it without making any changes, except in rare circumstances such as trade agreements that are fast-tracked or emergency legislation, or with minor ceremonial bills. That would be ridiculous.

    I don't care what you claimed before, and how you're weaseling out of it now. Not getting into a pissing match about it. The statement above is all that matters.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    Then he should have stipulated that these types of bills were not to be included in the discussion.

    He didn't.
    You know what you were talking about in the beginning. You were talking about the tax bill in the OP.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Let's look at this more closely:

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    The Health Care Reform Act was passed with no amendments.
    Really? One chamber of Congress passed the other's version without a single change?

    Let's look further:

    HR 3080 was passed with no amendments.
    ALL ACTIONS:
    10/3/2011:Referred to the House Committee on Ways and Means.
    10/5/2011:Committee Consideration and Mark-up Session Held.
    10/5/2011:Ordered to be Reported by the Yeas and Nays: 31 - 5.
    10/6/2011 10:20am:Reported by the Committee on Ways and Means. H. Rept. 112-239.
    10/6/2011 10:20am:Placed on the Union Calendar, Calendar No. 158.
    10/6/2011 3:02pm:Rules Committee Resolution H. Res. 425 Reported to House. The bills shall be considered as read and debatable for the time specfied in the report. Pursuant to section 151 of the Trade Act of 1974, the previous question shall be considered as ordered on H.R. 3079 and H.R. 3080 to final passage without intervening motion. The resolution provides one motion to recommit for H.R. 3078. The resolution makes in order a motion that the House concur in the Senate amendment to H.R. 2832. The Senate amendment shall be considered as read. The resolution provides for one hour of debate on the motion to concur.
    10/11/2011 6:59pm:Rule H. Res. 425 passed House.
    10/11/2011 9:42pm: Considered under the provisions of rule H. Res. 425. (consideration: CR H6758-6771)
    10/11/2011 9:42pm:The bills shall be considered as read and debatable for the time specfied in the report. Pursuant to section 151 of the Trade Act of 1974, the previous question shall be considered as ordered on H.R. 3079 and H.R. 3080 to final passage without intervening motion. The resolution provides one motion to recommit for H.R. 3078. The resolution makes in order a motion that the House concur in the Senate amendment to H.R. 2832. The Senate amendment shall be considered as read. The resolution provides for one hour of debate on the motion to concur.
    10/11/2011 9:42pm: DEBATE - The House proceeded with 90 minutes of debate on H.R. 3080.
    10/11/2011 10:20pm:Pursuant to clause 1(c) of Rule 19, further proceedings on H.R. 3080 were postponed.
    10/12/2011:Measure laid before Senate by unanimous consent. (consideration: CR S6399-6404, S6405-6407, S6412-6417, S6418-6446, S6447-6452)
    10/12/2011 3:17pm: Considered as unfinished business. (consideration: CR H6812-6832)
    10/12/2011 3:17pm: DEBATE - Pursuant to the provisions of H. Res. 425, the House proceeded with further debate on H.R. 3080.
    10/12/2011 4:40pm:The previous question was ordered pursuant to the rule. (consideration: CR H6832)
    10/12/2011 4:41pm:POSTPONED PROCEEDINGS - At the conclusion of debate on H.R. 3080, the Chair put the question on passage, and by voice vote announced that the ayes had prevailed. Mr. Levin demanded the yeas and nays and the Chair postponed further proceedings on the question of passage until a time to be announced.
    10/12/2011 6:09pm:Considered as unfinished business. (consideration: CR H6839-6840)
    10/12/2011 6:16pm:On passage Passed by the Yeas and Nays: 278 - 151 (Roll no. 783). (text: CR 10/11/2011 H6758-6767)
    10/12/2011 6:16pm:Motion to reconsider laid on the table Agreed to without objection.
    10/12/2011:Received in the Senate, read twice.
    10/12/2011:Passed Senate without amendment by Yea-Nay Vote. 83 - 15. Record Vote Number: 161.
    10/13/2011:Message on Senate action sent to the House. 10/13/2011:Presented to President.
    10/21/2011:Signed by President.
    10/21/2011:Became Public Law No: 112-41.



    And free trade acts are the one possible exception, since they are negotiated like treaties and can't simply be changed. It's hardly routine.

    The idea that one chamber routinely passes, without any changes, major legislation from the other chamber is obviously ridiculous.
    Last edited by misterman; 12-28-11 at 05:48 PM.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Link


    Time for the Senate to get their lardasses back to work.
    I get so tired of that type of political grand-standing by both sides. No, they aren't going to give up the holidays. No, it wouldn't make any difference if they did. All just pointless words at the basest form of politics.

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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Really? One chamber of Congress passed the other's version without a single change?

    Let's look further:

    ALL ACTIONS:
    10/3/2011:Referred to the House Committee on Ways and Means.
    10/5/2011:Committee Consideration and Mark-up Session Held.
    10/5/2011:Ordered to be Reported by the Yeas and Nays: 31 - 5.
    10/6/2011 10:20am:Reported by the Committee on Ways and Means. H. Rept. 112-239.
    10/6/2011 10:20am:Placed on the Union Calendar, Calendar No. 158.
    10/6/2011 3:02pm:Rules Committee Resolution H. Res. 425 Reported to House. The bills shall be considered as read and debatable for the time specfied in the report. Pursuant to section 151 of the Trade Act of 1974, the previous question shall be considered as ordered on H.R. 3079 and H.R. 3080 to final passage without intervening motion. The resolution provides one motion to recommit for H.R. 3078. The resolution makes in order a motion that the House concur in the Senate amendment to H.R. 2832. The Senate amendment shall be considered as read. The resolution provides for one hour of debate on the motion to concur.
    10/11/2011 6:59pm:Rule H. Res. 425 passed House.
    10/11/2011 9:42pm: Considered under the provisions of rule H. Res. 425. (consideration: CR H6758-6771)
    10/11/2011 9:42pm:The bills shall be considered as read and debatable for the time specfied in the report. Pursuant to section 151 of the Trade Act of 1974, the previous question shall be considered as ordered on H.R. 3079 and H.R. 3080 to final passage without intervening motion. The resolution provides one motion to recommit for H.R. 3078. The resolution makes in order a motion that the House concur in the Senate amendment to H.R. 2832. The Senate amendment shall be considered as read. The resolution provides for one hour of debate on the motion to concur.
    10/11/2011 9:42pm: DEBATE - The House proceeded with 90 minutes of debate on H.R. 3080.
    10/11/2011 10:20pm:Pursuant to clause 1(c) of Rule 19, further proceedings on H.R. 3080 were postponed.
    10/12/2011:Measure laid before Senate by unanimous consent. (consideration: CR S6399-6404, S6405-6407, S6412-6417, S6418-6446, S6447-6452)
    10/12/2011 3:17pm: Considered as unfinished business. (consideration: CR H6812-6832)
    10/12/2011 3:17pm: DEBATE - Pursuant to the provisions of H. Res. 425, the House proceeded with further debate on H.R. 3080.
    10/12/2011 4:40pm:The previous question was ordered pursuant to the rule. (consideration: CR H6832)
    10/12/2011 4:41pm:POSTPONED PROCEEDINGS - At the conclusion of debate on H.R. 3080, the Chair put the question on passage, and by voice vote announced that the ayes had prevailed. Mr. Levin demanded the yeas and nays and the Chair postponed further proceedings on the question of passage until a time to be announced.
    10/12/2011 6:09pm:Considered as unfinished business. (consideration: CR H6839-6840)
    10/12/2011 6:16pm:On passage Passed by the Yeas and Nays: 278 - 151 (Roll no. 783). (text: CR 10/11/2011 H6758-6767)
    10/12/2011 6:16pm:Motion to reconsider laid on the table Agreed to without objection.
    10/12/2011:Received in the Senate, read twice.
    10/12/2011:Passed Senate without amendment by Yea-Nay Vote. 83 - 15. Record Vote Number: 161.
    10/13/2011:Message on Senate action sent to the House. 10/13/2011:Presented to President.
    10/21/2011:Signed by President.
    10/21/2011:Became Public Law No: 112-41.



    And free trade acts are the one possible exception, since they are negotiated like treaties and can't simply be changed. It's hardly routine.

    The idea that one chamber routinely passes, without any changes, major legislation from the other chamber is obviously ridiculous.
    The Senate didn't amend, discuss, or change HR 3080 according to what you posted.

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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    Then he should have stipulated that these types of bills were not to be included in the discussion.

    He didn't.
    He didn't have to stipulate that. You did:

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    Yes, actually it happens all the time.

    Yes, they should have definitely voted on the original House bill with no amendments.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  8. #218
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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    The Senate didn't amend, discuss, or change HR 3080 according to what you posted.
    HR 3080 is not an "original House bill" as was dishonestly claimed by Gill. It was negotiated and submitted by the Executive branch.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    Yes, actually it happens all the time.

    Yes, they should have definitely voted on the original House bill with no amendments.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  9. #219
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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    HR 3080 is not an "original House bill" as was dishonestly claimed by Gill. It was negotiated and submitted by the Executive branch.
    Gotcha. too short

  10. #220
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    Re: Boehner demands Senate cancel its vacation

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    The Senate didn't amend, discuss, or change HR 3080 according to what you posted.
    Yes it did. It did so before the changes became part of Hr 3080. They worked on the changes in a different bill, and then the bills were combined and the changes accepted by the House so they wouldn't have to do it all over again:

    The resolution makes in order a motion that the House concur in the Senate amendment to H.R. 2832. The Senate amendment shall be considered as read.
    Look on page h6711 (oct. 11) of the Congressional Record, and it will show you where the House agreed to the Senate's amendment to the bill.

    Mr. CAMP. Mr. Speaker, pursuant to House Resolution 425, I call up the bill (H.R. 2832) to extend the Generalized System of Preferences, and for other purposes, with a Senate amendment thereto, and I have a motion at the desk.

    The Clerk read the title of the bill.

    The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Clerk will designate the Senate amendment.

    The text of the Senate amendment is as follows:
    The Senate's debate, including amendments, starts on page S5800 (Sept. 21). It is on a different bill number (HR 2832) - but that bill was then used as an amendment in the House to patch it all together as one bill - H.R. 3080. That process of patching together is also amending.

    Mr. McCAIN. Mr. President, I have an amendment at the desk, No. 625. I ask unanimous consent that it be made the pending business.

    The PRESIDING OFFICER. The clerk will report.

    The legislative clerk read as follows:

    The Senator from Arizona [Mr. McCain] proposes an amendment numbered 625 to amendment No. 633.
    ...and so on.

    Those amendments were then thrown in when the House combined the bills.

    The legislative process isn't always as simple as Schoolhouse Rock.
    Last edited by misterman; 12-29-11 at 10:28 AM.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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