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Kim Jong Il Dies

Samhain said:
Saw Robin Meade of HLN announce this story at about 6:30 today. They were showing footage of people crying in NK over it, including their state-run media outlets.

She appeared either moved by the crying or very confused, and I'm hoping for the later, because if any news person buys into the crying as genuine sadness, then they are on crack.
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Tons of people cried when Kennedy was assassinated, and he was only in office for like two years.
 
Khayembii Communique said:
Tons of people cried when Kennedy was assassinated, and he was only in office for like two years.
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How many people were paid to cry?

That's what I saw in that NK video release.
 
Proud South Korean said:
About the transition:
Right now it's too early to tell whether the transition will be smooth or rough.
From about 2009, there was an internal power struggle in North Korea that many detected. Many power players were assassinated or died under mysterious circumstances.
One of the most leading factions in the power struggle is Kim-Jong-Il's brother-in-law, Chang-Sung-Taek. He is reputed to have been the second most powerful man in North Korea (after Kim-Jong-Il himself), and is holding several powerful positions.
Another faction is lead by Oh-Keok-Ryul, a general who was formerly the number second in North Korea, but had recently fallen out of favor by Kim-Jong-Il in favor of Chang-Sung-Taek. He still remains very powerful, still commanding respect in the North Korean military.
There are of course, many competing interests and characters, and a power struggle, even a minor one, seems likely to happen.

There's one thing that some people don't seems to grasp. It's that Kim-Jong-Uen's succession will/is very different from Kim-Jong-Il's smooth one. Kim-Jong Il was prepared for many years to succeed Kim-Il-Sung, and held military command and such important positions for many years before his father's death. He also probably engineered the 1983 Yangon bombing in Burma which almost killed the Korean president Bak-Chung-Hee, and the Korean Air Flight 858 bombing, which killed all 115 people in the airplane.

However, Kim-Jong-Uen only had less than a decade to prepare, and the rapid weakening of Kim-Jong-Il's health sped it up. He's very young, much younger and inexperienced than Kim-Jong-Il was when he succeeded, and although appears to be very smart, is still yet very much young and inexperienced.

It will be a very rough transition. I wouldn't be surprised if many key people in North Korea are killed or likewise eliminated
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IMO, some of the purging has already occurred and it was probably sufficient to clear the way for Kim Jong-un's succession. In the early years of his rule, I don't believe he'll be able to exert the kind of control his father and grandfather did. There will be ideological constraints (Juche and Songun) that are viewed as "immortal" accomplishments and institutional ones (military role) that will limit his capacity to chart a radically different course. However, the military and Kim family have a shared overriding interest in maintaining something close to the current system, so they will make it "work." I don't expect a coup or revolution.

Unfortunately, only a handful of people have intimate knowledge and contacts with North Korea's key leaders (military and political). Most authorities the U.S. media rely on do not have that knowledge or relationships. It's a real problem for policy makers. Indeed, I believe that lack of knowlege is behind some Western countries' excessive optimism in viewing Kim Jong-il's passing as an opportunity for "opening."

Finally, China's voicing confidence in Kim Jong-un (http://www.reuters.c...E7BI0EB20111219) also decreases prospects of a genuine challenge to his authority. China's sentiments amount to China's taking a position that the new Kim should be given the opportunity to lead North Korea. I believe he will, even as there are some constraints as noted above.

In the meantime, I believe it is helpful that the U.S. has reaffirmed its commitments to South Korea's security. Making it abundantly clear that the U.S. views its bilateral relationship with South Korea as a critical one could help reduce North Korea's incentives to act in a provocative or worse fashion during its current political transition. North Korea's military leaders and its new political leader need to understand that the U.S. is 100% behind South Korea and willing and able to act to safeguard its partner and friend.
 
Your Star said:
Basically this, that whole country is brainwashed.

Have you seen the National Geographic doc with Lisa Ling? Fascinating look inside that messed up place.
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No I haven't, but I'll have to check into it. I've been looking at pictures from inside NK online and I find it all very fascinating.
 
vice travel guide to North Korea, pt. 1 of 14 :



interesting stuff. some profanity.
 
End of an era. Good. But what will the next one bring?
 
Alright. Time to face facts. NK's leadership is not the way it is because it likes to be mean and closed and starve its people :rolleyes:

It's just that other govts don't want to help it; they instead want to just exploit its desperate position to their advantage, and the US govt is notorious for doing that. The aid packages offered by nations (including the US) always come w/exploitative conditions. So for NK to surrender its nukes means surrendering its sovereignty and of course, it doesn't want that.

What NK should do is follow the China model of reforms--making a slow gradual transition to a more efficient market economy. It should try to establish closer relations w/China, if possible.

It also wouldn't hurt NK to allow the UN to inspect its nukes, assuming it has any that are functional. Once a nuclear deterrent is present and working, there's no reason for secrecy.

NK can reform itself w/the right leadership. We can only hope that the son rises to the challenge and makes it happen.
 
theplaydrive said:
No I haven't, but I'll have to check into it. I've been looking at pictures from inside NK online and I find it all very fascinating.
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It's on netflix if you have it.
 
Helix said:
vice travel guide to North Korea, pt. 1 of 14 :



interesting stuff. some profanity.
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I watched quite a few documentaries on North Korea when i was procrastinating from a presentation on their nuclear policy and what struck me after a while is that every foreign journalist who goes into NK to make a foreign documentary ends up in the exact same hotel room.
 
North Korea's film industry can now hopefully move past this...

pulgasari-5.jpg
 
Red_Dave said:
I watched quite a few documentaries on North Korea when i was procrastinating from a presentation on their nuclear policy and what struck me after a while is that every foreign journalist who goes into NK to make a foreign documentary ends up in the exact same hotel room.
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it's possible. every one of those rooms is probably bugged like crazy.

they probably don't need too many of them. not a tourist hot spot.
 
MEMORANDUM FROM SON OF FEARLESS LEADER - Your fearless leader is dead. The world must see you cry from grief. If the world does not see you cry from grief, then all of North Korea will see your family cry from grief. So put a cry on your face, and you will be happy, because you will not be dead.

Signed,

The crazy man's even crazier son
 
The world is a better place today than it was yesterday.
 
Empirica said:
The world is a better place today than it was yesterday.
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Why ?

İ am not a fan of that man but he was anti imperialist,

did he do anthing to you before ?
 
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What I can't wait for is how long it takes for them to make a mythology for this kid. They are already playing him up as the great leader (of course they would), but I am waiting for some of the wackier things to come up like they did for his father.

İ am not a fan of that man but he was anti imperialist,
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I would be hesitant to say that the world is now a better place, considering he has another who took his role, but I would not use the "anti-imperialist" line to suggest he had redeeming qualities. The guy was an absolute nightmare.
 
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Fiddytree said:
What I can't wait for is how long it takes for them to make a mythology for this kid. They are already playing him up as the great leader (of course they would), but I am waiting for some of the wackier things to come up like they did for his father.



I would be hesitant to say that the world is now a better place, considering he has another who took his role, but I would not use the "anti-imperialist" line to suggest he had redeeming qualities. The guy was an absolute nightmare.[/FONT][/COLOR]
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I agree, he is an unproven other who by that definition may prove to be far worse. He's young and most probably was raised in a bubble having little acquaintance with the realities of the world. PSK said he's only better than his elder two brothers because they are incredibly stupid. Not a glowing recommendation.
 
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Fiddytree said:
What I can't wait for is how long it takes for them to make a mythology for this kid. They are already playing him up as the great leader (of course they would), but I am waiting for some of the wackier things to come up like they did for his father.



I would be hesitant to say that the world is now a better place, considering he has another who took his role, but I would not use the "anti-imperialist" line to suggest he had redeeming qualities. The guy was an absolute nightmare.[/FONT][/COLOR]
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yes ı agree with you,he was night mare because he was anti imperialist :)
 
I think the true believers and faithful followers of the Elvis-style bouffant hair-do lost a great man today. But other than that, I say good riddance to bad rubbish.

Is it true his son has a mullet?
 
F**k me, the fare prices on these Korean trains are enough to give someone a heart attack!
 
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roughdraft274 said:
Another foreign policy victory for the Obama administration...
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Yeah, they finally didn't **** something up. Kim Jung IL is now Kim Jung Dead, hahahah. That's funny.
 
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